from our friends at Broadcastingcable.com:
Keep hope alive, all you fans of NBC’s not-yet-canceled Lipstick Jungle.
Speaking Tuesday with B&C Editor-in-Chief Ben Grossman for a Think Tank session at the 2009 NATPE conference in Las Vegas, NBC Entertainment co-chair Ben Silverman offered another reason to believe the drama, which has been on the bubble for several months, may yet return.
“Lipstick Jungle is so strong and has such a passionate base among a coveted demographic,” Silverman said. “That kind of show will have the same approach, and we’ve already begun that approach, as we’ve used with Friday Night Lights. [...]
Read the rest at broadcastingcable.com
Lipstick Jungle is so strong
In what way?
This sort of chasing the profits rather than the hits is what’s going to continue to keep NBC down. If they can get someone to foot the bill, yeah, the show can be profitable. But they will never be able to regain a foothold in broadcast TV again if they keep shows like Lipstick Jungle and Friday Night Lights around.
trust me, seeing this was an “OH GOD, PLEASE.MAKE.IT.STOP” moment, but alas, this is the business we have chosen.
I don’t recall seeing a “passionate base among a coveted demographic.” Did I miss something? You all had it pegged for cancellation since it came back on the air! And if Friday Night Lights is any indication of what the Direct TV to NBC approach is going to do for shows, it would just be better to kill Lipstick Jungle now and put it out of its misery.
I’m sticking to the theory that Silverman has a crush on Brooke Shields (or perhaps Kim Raver, or…both!). That may be completely untrue, and yet it makes more sense than anything he’s actually saying.
Silverman is an idiot and just cancel the show. No one is watching it and there are no fan base for the show. Just let it go Ben, just let it go
I watched it.
The season finale was definitely a series ender though.
I’m one who hopes the show is NOT CANCELLED! I enjoy Lipstiok Jungle, although I don’t watch it on Friday nights due to my work schedule. DVR takes care of that for me!
I think there is room for this show, and I do believe there are a lot of fans of the show who will feel the same way. Like with anything else, if you don’t like it, don’t watch it! But leave the rest of us alone. You just go find a different show to watch for an hour while the rest of us have our fun!
KEEP THIS SHOW ALIVE PLEASE!!!
@Julia,
If profit does not define a “hit” for a broadcast network, then what does? Ratings alone? By conventional means, it seems Nielsen ratings are the only metric by which to define “hit.” If NBC finds a way around Nielsen ratings while achieving profit goals, then NBC has, for all intesive purposes, redefined what a “hit” is. For that matter, they’ve redefined what a broadcast network needs to be in order to provide quantifiable success (ROI, profit to shareholders, etc…). Broadcast networks may eventually become extinct altogether. NBC could be seen as the first network to fail, or as the one who was ahead of the curve. Only time will tell.
I’m not saying NBC will succeed at this venture, but I do respect Silverman and company’s risky moves on some level.
At Least Friday Night Lights is a critically acclaimed show. Lipstick Jungle is well, ya know… now that you mention it that crush on Brooke Shields might be the reason.
clutz, the NBC brand is dying. Going to great lengths to keep certain individual shows slightly profitable may work in the short term, but it is not a long term solution for NBC. Advertising is still what drives the TV business and advertisers are not going to want to work with NBC if they can get better numbers, and more niche audiences on cable. Which is where shows like Lipstick Jungle stand right now.
My theory is that NBC decision makers just really like their 24 Kim Raver free. Like most everyone else. So they are willing to make sacrifices.
clutz,
I have to cosign what you said about profitablity vs ratings. Afterall networks seek ratings to drive advertising revenue. The goal is to maximize ad revenue in order to maximize profitability. Ratings are the goal, but the means to to achieve the goal.
Julia,
Not sure exactly what you are talking when you detach profitability from advertising. If a show is profitable, that means advertisers are paying to advertise on that show. NO SHOW IS PROFITABLE WITHOUT ADVERTISING! It is the only way a show makes money (at least before syndication and LJ is no where near that)
In my previous post it should read “Ratings are NOT the goal, but the means to achieve the goal.”
(sorry for the typo)
Everybody else at NATPE wants/gets to talk about their hit shows or at least their new shows they hope will be hits. No luck for Silverman. No hits, and Leno at 10 has already been talked to death, so he is reduced to talking about how his loser shows might not be losers.
Oh, and freezing rain = not fun.
lol. lipstick jungle was the bombdigity. and in fact consistantly won many key demographics if you looked closely at the ratings….. and performed much better than friday night lights in fact….. i do believe the show has a place in the fall schedule. a show like this needs to be nurtured and given time to grow. the last few episodes of season 2 were fantastic.
Loved Lipstick Jungle, I personally think that the name itself was/is part of the problem.
Would hate to see this not continue. It never had a chance to grow and a Friday evening time slot pretty much drives the final nail in!
I hope the show stays on the network. It is a really good show and if NBC wants to keep the show on the air, what is it any business of yours (I’m speaking to the people who complain about it as I’m sure you don’t even watch it)
I think NBC like the idea of viewers who watch the show have a higher annual income so I think that is a good enough reason to keep the show on the air.
Mike G. says:
January 27th, 2009 at 12:29 pm
I don’t recall seeing a “passionate base among a coveted demographic.” Did I miss something? You all had it pegged for cancellation since it came back on the air! And if Friday Night Lights is any indication of what the Direct TV to NBC approach is going to do for shows, it would just be better to kill Lipstick Jungle now and put it out of its misery.
DirectTv actually did an excellent job with FNL. Season 3(like season 1)was one of the best dramas us tv had to present.
It doesn’t hurt a network’s image to have at least one quality show on its schedule (Friday Night Lights)… A show that it could be proud of. Let the Super Bowl ads make up for the advertising loss.
This should bode well for Chuck…I mean how can NBC fathom keeping Lipstick Jungle but not Chuck
Omi: And have you seen FNL’s ratings since its return to NBC? They’re terrible. Sure people might have watched it on Direct TV, and yes the show may be wonderful. But, running it on DTV first has done absolutely nothing to boost its ratings on NBC.
Adam: The same way that Fox can fathom keeping ‘Til Death.
Coolbreeze, what NBC did with Friday Night Lights and implies they want to do with Lipstick Jungle is they found someone else to foot a good portion (though we don’t know how much) of the bill for the cost of the show, so the could still (possibly) be profitable even with ratings like many NBC shows have gotten. Like I said, this works in the short term. But in the long term, why would advertisers remain with NBC? Eventually this will not work, and NBC needs to look towards the future and how to fix what is desperately broken on that network. Renewing shows like Lipstick Jungle is not it.
I fully believe that NBC is going the way of the DoDo Bird. I mean in all seriousness wtf are they thinking over there? When THE OFFICE and its 8 million viewers is the best you can show for….
It’s time for some major changes. I think Silverman’s leash is about to be shortened. While he has made NBC more profitable and his plans with Leno will only make things cheaper next season…. the Network is dying. It can’t continue to have numbers on shows that the CW is comparative with.
I think Ben will be following Dawn out their respective doors in the next 2 years.
NBC – Nothing But Crap
Nice way to stay in last place NBC!
God just cancel the show already
Keeping a show like FNL or 30 Rock for prestige reasons, if they aren’t burning a hole in your pocket is one thing, but not having even one competitive ratings powerhouse and hardly anything that’s doing better than your critically acclaimed croakers, that’s not much of a foundation to build on.
Why any network would want to keep Lipstick Jungle is a mystery to me. FNL must be dirt cheap by now, 30 Rock brings in the awards buzz, The Office is at least a demos wonder, Law and Order is close to some kind of record, but when everything but the Biggest Loser is already scraping by on some sort of excuse, surely at least then it’s time to cut the bottom of the barrel shows.
Well, there’s a long-standing tradition of fourth-place networks to be the innovative ones, and to stick with borderline shows longer. Sometimes, quality does persist and a show really only takes off in its second or third season. Look at “Hill Street Blues” or “Cagney & Lacey” or even “Seinfeld”. In fact, you may argue that this is exactly what’s happening to “30 Rock” right now, if in a slightly more modest way.
Every once in a while, there will be a show that you hope will work out that way. It’s certainly what kept “Veronica Mars” on the air for three years.
So I’ll cut the NBC programmers some slack. They are trying to stick to shows they believe in, and it’s hard sometimes to know when you really, really have to cut your losses.
Mike G,I agree with you about the ratings. I thought your comment had to do with the quality of the show since it aired on DirectTv. Maybe the future of FNL is exclusively on DirectTv which is absolutely thrilled and satisfied with the show unlike NBC.
Even with these ratings of FNL shouldn’t NBC be satisfied with a show whose production’s costs are split with DirectTv? I mean it should be cheap for them to produce, therefore it’s not an ecomical disaster for the network..
@Ray, “Seinfeld” is a prime example of sticking by a series even when ratings are low, and critics are mixed. Seinfeld spent three seasons with very low ratings, amidst critics’ complaints that no one outside of NYC would ever get it. NBC stuck by it, and it became the anchor of “Must See TV.” There was even an episode where Jerry joked that a rival comedian was a “time slot hit,” who only got laughs because he followed Seinfeld
. That was true of everything NBC tried in the 9:30pm EST half-hour. Plenty of time slot hits that did not stand on their own without the Seinfeld lead-in. Today, I can watch five Seinfeld eps in syndication any weekday, and it still hits the syndication top 20 Nielsens on a regular basis.
However, LJ is a very different series than Seinfeld. As a one-hour drama with three strong female leads, and what seems to be a strong female perspective in general, it’s got less of a chance of building a broad audience.
idizzle, since there’s not even one powerhouse as you say on NBC’s schedule shouldn’t they leave FNL & 30 Rock do their job? at least these shows bring some great reviews for the network.. NBC’s problem won’t be solved by canceling FNL. The show was never a ratings magnet and it was not meant to be from the beginning. They should focus on new projects but keep their criticaly acclaimed shows as their image seems the only thing NBC has to work with.
omi, that’s actually pretty much what I meant. That when you have to keep a low rated show, keep the ones that serve some other purpose. 30 Rock is very much an image project and that’s why it got renewed and it has its place on NBC. My point, that apparently I failed to express adequately, is that NBC has better low ated shows to entertain than Lipstick Jungle. Actually low rated critical darlings are pretty much all the have that doesn’t start with Law and Order.
I don’t think i’d be totally shocked if DirecTv found a way to keep FNL. They probably got bigger ratings for that then any other show they show on the 101. Not to mention I read that now they picked up the 18 episodes of Sleeper Cell to air weekly starting this week. The channel is dying for good, scripted TV to show on their 101 channel and if there is a way to work it out i think they might try to hang onto FNL with or without NBC. If (and I quote Bob Barker) the price is right.
But IS DirecTV truly happy with the viewership FNL got? I think I read a press release where someone behind the network claimed they were, but I’ve seen that sort of statement before about shows that were soon cancelled. What do they really, honestly think?
Lisa, the way I see it, DirecTV has to claim to be happy with the numbers no matter what, but they probably weren’t truly disappointed in them, either. The question is, were they getting enough viewers to pay for whatever they were paying to NBC? In my opinion, if they were, NBC is in big trouble, because they were probably depending on FNL getting numbers similar to last season, and having the bit DirecTV threw at them to get half a million viewers or so worth it. But the numbers have taken a severe drop from last season, and if DirecTV wants the same deal, FNL will not be profitable. (And in this case it may already be losing money, if they sold the ads at last year’s rate, which I’m sure they did.)
This is all just supposition on what the deal was. It could be that DirecTV paid a ton of money and sees the returns in other ways, like new subscribers or something. But we’ll never know for sure, and will only be able to guess based on whether the deal is repeated or not.
idizzle sorry, i didn’t want to sound aggressive.. i agree with what you said, i just wanted to emphasize your point.
Lisa, DirectTv IS happy with FNL as it is reported to be interested in a fourth season.
Well, don’t think the posters here are the only ones arguing about NBC’s future. Nikke Finke reports that just-off-the-boat head of development Angela Bromstad and Silverman are already off speaking terms
deadlinehollywooddaily.com
Now, the 2 or 3 people who watched “Lipstick Jungle” will get solace from DirecTV?
Some of you guys are missing the point. With DVRs etc., people barely watch commercials. I know I don’t. Lipstick Jungle had TREMENDOUS tie-in possibilities which NBC didn’t waste anytime exploiting. From the womens’ clothes, to their makeup and purses, even their luggage, everything was a brand tie-in and I didn’t even mind… because I actually wanted to know so I could buy it (or more likely a knock-off)! Like many others, I DVRed this show, but I certainly watched much more advertising than I do while watching Greys or House because the ads were pretty much within the show and seamlessly fit in. Silverman is right. LJ is a gold mine.
I’m impatient with some of the comments above, but usually the BS detectors of many of the posters here cancels out the need to pick apart obvious PR and hype. Larger issues are involved here, in no particular order: One, in the pre-recession days, when retail was doing OK, a show like Sex in the City, which never had impressive ratings even by HBO standards, and is not on the radar screen for top syndies, or a movie like The Devil Wears Prada, were meant to pump up the fashion and cosmetics industry, and to some extent the fairly lucrative ( in the magazine publishing world ) womens’ magazines. If you can connect making money with a popular political agenda ( ” Sex in the City, Lipstick Jungle, chick lit etc are examples of womens’ empowerment…” ) you have even more favor from both LA and NYC power players. Second, shows with strong female leads like Starter Wife and the cop drama with Kyra Sedgwick hold their own in basic cable ratings. If cable and the nets continue to divide the ratings spoils 50-50 or even 55-45, why not hold onto shows cheap to produce ( if LJ is being partly financed by an angel ) on NBC as well as USA, TNT etc. Third, with so much emphasis placed – and I see no strong evidence yet for this emphasis or for the extent of it anyway – on the 18-49 bracket, and with the male side of the demo tied to obvious things like wrestling, team sports, etc, the female 18-49 is most coveted and most elusive of all. I’m sure LJ does better percentagewise with 18-34 and 18-49 women than with overall viewers. In a sense the Seinfeld and Cheers comparisons are not so outrageous when you consider 18-34 women as the goal and not the general audience. With persistence shows like LJ, if not LJ itself, may be worth keeping on the air for that reason alone. Four, network heads have got to feel the era of cop shows and reality shows can’t last forver. The Western, the hayseed sitcome, even the Norman Lear shoutfests with a ” message,” all eventually had to go. Anyway, I’m on record as disliking DH ( after 2005 ) GA etc, but look at the numbers – they actually do compete with the procedurals. ( For that matter, so does the Bachelor and Home Makeover.)
Jay writes: “I’m sure LJ does better percentagewise with 18-34 and 18-49 women than with overall viewers.”
If this something that can be confirmed? And if this is so, how does it compare to other shows which has been proven to be popular with women, like House?
From NBC to MSNBC – they are a total mess. Im waiting for them to add “Barack Obama: The Wonder Years, Hosted by Keith Olbermann and Chris Matthews” 6 nights a week, to the prime time lineup before Leno. Sure to send tingles down the legs of the network few remaining viewers.
The only thing left worth watching on NBC is HEROES (sort of…to be frank its a pale imitation of its former glory of Season 1).
Hard to believe NBC has fallen so far from its glory days of the 80s and 90s. Their only consolation is that CW is still around so they aren’t THE WORST network.
NBC is such a jungle!
Andrea, it’s something that can be easily figured out for someone who wants to do the legwork. All the final ratings are here and once you figure out the season average just compare it to the total 18-49 viewers listed in the Renew/Cancel index. I don’t have the patience to do that (though I’m going to work in twenty minutes and may be bored enough to take it on then) but if anyone does, I would be very interested to see the data as well.
Julia, Unless I’m missing something, sitcomsonline doesn’t provide the male-female demo break outs. exmalibu at pifeedback does, but only for 18-49 and 25-54, not 18-34.
Ah, I missed the women part. Yeah, that’s a lot more work.
I will be devastated if Friday Night Lights doesn’t return for a fourth season. NBC or DirecTV or both, I don’t care. Just give me more FNL!
Ironic that there doing this thing in Las Vegas…
LAs Vegas would be one of NBC’s top shows now!
I agree SO MUCH!
I am in Greece Europe and watching EVERY episode,
I am a strong woman with a career, im 34, about to get married,
and FINALLY
a show SHOWS how it is for a woman, and the way she has to deal with things.
FINALLY something that does not betray my intelligence as sex in the city did, of which i maybe ever saw 3 episodes- couldnt stand it.
FINALLY something that feels real and not from a different world. It is VERY natural,
I love Brooke Shields and Lindsay Price and Raver, they are just … one of a kind, EACH of them. The photography,…real, perfect, inspired..
I hate brookes husband in the show but again,(his character is pictured somehow like having a low IQ, which ofcourse is something that can happen in life and shows her making a compromise – am sure she somehow is wishing deep inside shed have a husband that is more active from the start and not this “sorry”, “shyish” boy-man that wakes up suddenly to realise he wasnt taking care of himself and blaming everybody else!.
THIS is the first time i think
this has been portrayed by a man in a sitcom, i mean in this honest way -
a man,
in the position a woman usually is/or was, after her kids grew up and shes there suddenly having no plans in life, being angry that she didnt foresee this day coming – because she didnt take time to work or achieve her personal goals, in order to take care the rest of the family.
So convenient for men to look away from this wonderful story.
Oh Lindseys man, he is also in this difficult situation.
finally men with feelings, but like they are in reality. not all the same and flat like in other sitcom or movies.
the casting COULDNT be better….. (again except Brookes husband which everytime i see him somehow, i feel he is overacting the role.. but it might also be that i hate whiny men/roles and this is maybe the point in his role)
so many feelings…
it would be TOTALLY be a shame to cut the show.
thanks for reading my thoughts…
I love lipstick jungle couldnt live without it.
oh ,. and lindsay price in her role….. the most beautifull charismatic role / woman / visual..
replaces all the empty barbie dreams i maybe once had as a little girl.
for the people saying negative things about it – I agree with another comment posted earlier “if you don’t like it, don’t watch it! But leave the rest of us alone. You just go find a different show to watch for an hour while the rest of us have our fun! ”
KEEP THIS SHOW ALIVE PLEASE!!! “
This show is an insult to me as a woman. It’s the same genre that constantly infantilizes women, that is classist and super elitist. This show and others like it do NOT represent women, but a distorted fantasy of white rich men about women – as obsessive consumers, self centered, stuck up drama queens, not to mentioned with warped and unrealistic body image.
Cancel this garbage already!
The show is fun!! Why do we have to have every show on TV cops/dead bodies or reality? Life is awful for alot of people today and this show is good for the imagination. Come on people stop looking for the boring reality show they are old hat. Enjoy dreaming of high powered jobs in the big city and having fun.
Is The 101 even reported by Nielsen? Or do DirecTV have a return-path panel of their own?
Obviously most of you aren’t reggular watchers of this show. This is one of the greatest shows that has been on the air in a long time. How can you say it insults you as a woman. This show empowers women! Not to mention it is beautifully filmed and the chemsitry between the actors is phenomenal. I still have my fingers crossed.; It would be an excellent move to keep this show on the air. I have many friends and family members who all feel the same way. Keep it on NBC. I’m sick of those ridiculous reality shows and stupid predictable sitcoms and dramas out there. Lipstick jungle is realistic and wonderful.
Just because you don’t look like the women on the show or have the same clothes as them doesn’t mean you should be spiteful and resentful at the show. I don’t look like anyone on tv. I’m not on a reality show or an FBI agent fighting crime but I can relate to lipstick jungle not because I have a high profile job, because I don’t, but because they are empowered women who are independant and not at home making dinner everynight for their husbands. I am inspired by these women and by this show.
and lindsay price is wonderfully adorable.
i agree Meghun…i watch this show on Living TV every Monday in the UK. Season 2 has just finished here and i am gutted to here it might not be coming back. I never missed an eppisode. the cast, stories and chemistry are some of the best i’ve seen on TV. Lipstick Jungle is by far my fav am totally hooked as are all my friends here in the UK!
Lindsay Price is my hero i adore her…
sorry Meghan.. not meghun
my girlfriends and i love this show and these woman please dont cancel!!!!!!!!!!!!!
lipstick jungle that is