| Scoreboard |  |
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Total Viewers (million) | 18.65 | 15.65 | 9.70 | 5.67 | 4.36 | .95 |
| Rating/Share: Adults 18-49 | 7.3/17 | 3.2/8 | 3.5/9 | 2.1/5 | 1.7/4 | 0.4/1 |
| Rating/Share: Adults 18-34 | 6.4/17 | 2.1/6 | 2.8/8 | 1.9/5 | 1.8/5 | 0.4/1 |
I’m not one who thinks that because Fringe is losing 50% of its American Idol lead in that it’s a disappointment. This week’s performance was almost identical to last week’s for Fringe, but the difference this week is that Idol did a bit better because it didn’t have the inauguration as competition.
Keeping in mind that the numbers will change because there’s a minute or two of American Idol rolling over into Fringe, Fringe averaged 12.091 million and a 4.8/11 (rating/share) among 18-49 year olds, second in the hour to NBC’s The Biggest Loser (12.92, 5.0/12). Again, the half hourly drops were noticeable for Fringe going from 13.206 million and a 5.2/12 the first half hour to 10.975 million and a 4.3/10. Minus the small portion of American Idol included in the first half hour the gap wouldn’t be as wide and based on last year, I’d have to guess FOX feels pretty good about Fringe, even the second half hour.
A new episode of NCIS impressively still pulled 19.04 million and a 3.9/10 up against American Idol at 8pm. Over 1/3rd of the 18-49 year old watching TV from 9pm-10pm were watching either American Idol or NCIS.
The Mentalist’s performance in a rerun at 9pm was impressive, first overall in viewers with 15.13 million though third among 18-49 year olds (2.9/7), but still better than a new episode of Without a Trace at 10pm (12.76 million 2.7/7)
Full details:
| Time | Net | Show | Viewers (Millons) | 18-49 Rating/Share | 18-34 Rating/Share |
| 8:00 | FOX | American Idol | 25.20 | 9.6/24 | 8.6/23 |
| CBS | NCIS | 19.04 | 3.9/10 | 2.8/7 | |
| NBC | The Biggest Loser: Couples | 9.07 | 3.2/8 | 2.7/7 | |
| ABC | Homeland Security USA | 5.60 | 1.7/4 | 1.2/3 | |
| UNI | Cuidado con el Angel | 4.70 | 1.9/5 | 2.1/6 | |
| CW | 90210 (R) | 1.06 | 0.4/1 | 0.4/1 | |
| 9:00 | CBS | The Mentalist (R) | 15.13 | 2.9/7 | 2.0/5 |
| NBC | The Biggest Loser: Couples | 12.92 | 4.9/12 | 4.0/10 | |
| FOX | Fringe | 12.09 | 4.8/11 | 4.2/11 | |
| UNI | Fuego en la Sangre | 5.15 | 2.0/5 | 2.1/5 | |
| ABC | Scrubs | 5.12 | 2.2/5 | 2.4/6 | |
| CW | Privileged (R) | 0.84 | 0.3/1 | 0.4/1 | |
| 9:30 | ABC | Scrubs | 5.05 | 2.3/5 | 2.5/7 |
| 10:00 | CBS | Without a Trace | 12.76 | 2.7/7 | 1.7/5 |
| NBC | Law & Order: SVU (R) | 7.12 | 2.5/6 | 1.8/5 | |
| ABC | Primetime: What Would You Do? | 6.31 | 2.3/6 | 1.8/5 | |
| UNI | Aqui y Ahora | 3.24 | 1.3/3 | 1.3/4 |
Shows are sorted by viewers in each time slot.
Nielsen TV Ratings: ©2009 The Nielsen Company. All Rights Reserved.
Definitions:
Fast Affiliate Ratings: These first national ratings, including demographics, are available at approximately 11 AM (ET) the day after telecast, and are released to subscribing customers daily. These data, from the National People Meter sample, are strictly time-period information, based on the normal broadcast network feed, and include all programming on the affiliated stations, sometimes including network programming, sometimes not. The figures may include stations that did not air the entire network feed, as well as local news breaks or cutaways for local coverage or other programming. Fast Affiliate ratings are not as useful for live programs and are likely to differ significantly from the final results, because the data reflect normal broadcast feed patterns. For example, with a World Series game, Fast Affiliate Ratings would include whatever aired from 8-11PM on affiliates in the Pacific Time Zone, following the live football game, but not game coverage that begins at 5PM PT. The same would be true of Presidential debates as well as live award shows and breaking news reports.
Rating: Estimated percentage of the universe of TV households (or other specified group) tuned to a program in the average minute. Ratings are expressed as a percent.
Share (of Audience): The percent of households (or persons) using television who are tuned to a specific program, station or network in a specific area at a specific time. (See also, Rating, which represents tuning or viewing as a percent of the entire population being measured.)
Time Shifted Viewing – Program ratings for national sources are produced in three streams of data – Live, Live+Same Day (Live+SD) and Live+7 Day. Time shifted figures account for incremental viewing that takes place with DVRs which are currently in approximately 24.4% of all U.S. TV households. Live+Same Day (Live+SD) include viewing during the same broadcast day as the original telecast, with a cut-off of 3:00AM local time when meters transmit daily viewing to Nielsen for processing. Live+7 Day ratings include incremental viewing that takes place during the 7 days following a telecast.
For more information see Numbers 101.
wasn’t fringe up against the mentalist? in that case, id say it did okay, considering it didnt lose much from last weeks ratings. in fact, the 18-49 numbers are 0.1 better..
it was up against The Mentalist, but Mentalist was a repeat (with impressive numbers though)
Fringe has gotten better, this weeks melting brain computer virus was a real Killer App!
I can see how some American Idol viewers would be interested in this episode as they personally experience this brain melting phenomenon after viewing an episode of Idol.
Well NBC must be in dreamland as the second hour of The Biggest Loser beat Fringe in both viewers and demos. Granted
Another positive view for NBC, was the performance of a repeat L&0:SVU in the demos against a new Without a Trace.
It would be very interesting to see what NBC does next year on Tuesdays, stick with a 2 hour edition of The Biggest Loser and shift SVU or just have one hour of the reality skin.
I think they would probably keep the 2 hour format since it works fairly well for them and move SVU to Wednesdays or Fridays.
Wow, 5.0 in the demo for The Biggest Loser? Was this a special? I know it always does well, but for NBC to have a show get a 5.0 is a huge deal.
Fringe would probably be pulling in Prison Break numbers if it wasn’t piggybacking off of American Idol and House.
Poor SCRUBS. This is the first year i’m watching it, instead of in reruns. It seems to be better this year than in previous seasons. The numbers are not even decent. I liked Eli Stone too, it’s sad that Primetime is pulling better numbers than Eli.
With Idol & NCIS, 44 milion, where have these viewers been hiding all season? (besides not watching network tv…lol)
FYI, Biggest Loser’s 9pm hour updated from a 5.0 to a 4.9. The report I used has some rounding issues when rolling up half hourly data to the hour level. Unfortunately, the error is not consistent which makes it kind of a pain, but anyway, I’ve updated the numbers. No 5.0 for NBC, sorry Ben.
(besides not watching network tv…lol)
I don’t think there is any besides. They’ve just been watching cable.
@Andrea: Agree.
I don’t see the audience for Fringe growing much more than what it is right now. The enjoyment factor of the show is completely centered around each week’s plotline, and not on the characters. If the pattern of the week is boring, than the ratings will follow. If they want to get House numbers, the writers have to make us care more about characters. So, regardless of the pattern that is occuring, we’ll tune in to watch faithfully.
I think Prison Break would be more New Amsterdam-esque in that slot. Fringe gives the appearance (based on second half hour retention) that it could do a 3.0 or better among 18-49 year olds standing on its own.
But appearances can be deceiving. Either way, New Amsterdam is cancelled, and Prison Break’s end has been announced.
Fox should be very happy with the numbers that Fringe is pulling in. A pop singing competition and a show featuring exploding brain matter doesn’t exactly attract the same audiences.
Without Idol, Fringe had been getting 8-9 million in the Fall before the break while PB was alot lower than that at 5 million or so before the break (along with a much worse 18-49 demo about half that of Fringe). Fact is Prison Break is tired and worn out and hasnt really been good since Season 1.
The importance of lead in’s is highly overrated in any case. Same goes for people who blame going up against Idol (Jericho fans loved this theory) kills a show – NCIS blows that premise out of the water.
My Gosh…NCIS & IDOL seemed to have found enough people out there to share…but I still don’t know ANYONE who watches or has watched NCIS??!!??
Robert,
It all comes down to what a network favors. Fringe will seemingly never be allowed to fail. If it starts to go down in ratings, I’m sure Kevin Reilly will be on the phone with his buddy at DirectTV to try to save it, like he did with Friday Night Lights, when he was at NBC.
At least with Lie To Me, we’ll get the chance to see what it does as the lead-in to AI in a week. Making the switch gives me the impression that FOX has the belief that this show can be a true hit.
Regarding not giving Dollhouse a AI or House lead-in and sticking it on Fridays where FOX has not had a breakout hit success in a decade…well…no comment.
Dont know which one is the Biggest Loser of the night… Fringe that couldnt beat Biggest Loser or Without a Trace for droping from a Mentalist repeat.
Um…I watch NCIS…Now you know one R.G…Nice to meet you…
I also watch NCIS – now you know two people RG!
Without a Trace did right around what it always does. It couldn’t have been expected to go up with a weaker lead in than usual. While Without a Trace is on its last legs and I don’t expect to see it back next season, this particular week is no greater loser than usual.
@Name required. Fringe was getting those numbers with House as a lead-in, PB with Sarah Connor as a lead-in Big difference. I agree: Fringe on its own would get 6-7 millions at best
Wow how long will the CW last with those numbers? Is it just me or have the ratings gotten worse since they merged together UPN and The WB. They should not have made that move.
I watch NCIS as well. That makes two of us.
Eddie, while CW is in huge trouble, last night was all repeats so you can’t really judge. (You sort of can, but you’re not supposed to.
) As for the merger, yes the ratings dropped, but without the merger both networks would have had to shut down by now.
Tony: I’m sure they are okay with the numbers. Just not what they expected.
Name Required: Before AI, Fringe was bumped up by House. Look at what it did for its series premiere, which was prior to House’s season premiere. The numbers were not that great. For Fringe (and any show that got paired with AI and House), lead-in does matter. If it wasn’t so, these shows wouldn’t be paired with AI and House, and it would be big news if they did.
RG: I’m assuming that a lot of military/law enforcement types watch this show, as well as older women who heart Mark Harmon and probably followed his career from St. Elsewhere, to the ’80s cult movie Back To School, to Chicago Hope and now to NCIS. I know that you’re just salivating for the NCIS spinoff that will premiere next fall
Andrea, I’m sure networks make guesses about what will do well where and so shows they think will do well get favored over shows they think will do less well. But then they get actual data. If Fringe were sucking in the demos, I don’t think FOX would favor it.
New Amsterdam got the Idol lead-in and still tanked. Making it not a favorite! I don’t think Reilly was sitting around last year thinking “Please God, let New Amsterdam’s ratings stink so we can rub Fringe in its fans faces next year!”
btw, the FNL deal with DTV was announced well after Reilly was at FOX. Was that really still his deal?
If you look at the beginning numbers of 24 (season 1 around 8-9 millions viewers) the x-files 1st season(a little bit under 8 millions), the Alias ratings (something like 10 millions for season 1), I think Fringe is doing REAL good.
For a show of this kind of course. This isn’t House, or CSI. Don’t expect it to kick 15 millions on is first season. This year especially. So I think Fringe on is own could expect a 10 millions per episodes. That’s pretty good. And I’m sure the show will come back for a second season. I’m also sure FOX is happy with these numbers.
I watch NCIS too, guess that makes three. Anyway, what’s with the criticism of FOX giving Fringe strong leadins? Perhaps (I’m going to go outside the box here) they want the show to do well? There’s a thought! It pulled in 9 million by itself and (I think) around another 6 million on the repeat of the pilot, so Andrea’s “Prison Break numbers” comment has proof to the contrary.
Julia, you’re right but losing from a REPEAT and SVU in repeat mode, should be doing better.
I love it when I’m right. I said that Fringe was gonna do about 12 million viewers several weeks ago. It’s a genre show. Fox isn’t complaining, especially with how nicely House and Bones are anchoring Mondays and Thursdays.
Good for NBC for getting decent ratings with at least one of their shows. They should keep it 2 hours next fall, then move SVU to Wednesdays at 9 with the original airing at 8.
Is ABC planning on fixing Tuesday, or is it just the spring version of ABC’s failed Wednesday in the fall?
So I think Fringe on is own could expect a 10 millions per episodes.
Except it wasn’t doing that even when it had House as a lead in.
Holly, I think they’re just waiting for DWTS and Cupid. But Scrubs is not doing THAT bad. Homeland is a filler and Primetime must be cheap
Fringe should be lucky breaking a 3.0 in the demo in their own.
Robert:
NA got one week of American Idol, Tuesday and Thursday. In both cases it was #1 and #2 in the timeslot, respectively. On that Tuesday, it got 13 million and a 4.5 share–similar to Fringe. NA then moved to Mondays–something that Fringe will do, unless it’s after House.
Now, I’m sorry, what were you saying? (She says in a non-hostile way).
Correction: Fringe will NOT do…ever.
@sam
X-Files did not have any lead-in they were not spoon-fed by big lead ins like fringe got from House and AI
infact X-Files started out on Friday nights (supposedly death slot) and went onto become the biggest cult hit with season 3-5 averaging over 20 million viewer and season 4 episode Leonard betts getting 29 million viewers (highest for any SCI-FI show till date)
Now that’s what i call a True Hit , X-Files stood on it’s own without any support unlike Fringe
i also Respect BONES in this case they also stood out on their own without any good lead-ins
Ah! I forgot about the 5 hours/week of DWTS.
Why is MyNetworkTV never on these charts? Are there ratings a lot worse than the CW’s?
Are you not thinking or what? Prison Break pulled 10 mio viewers in it’s first season and in the second season even more, and it has no lead-in, and in third season it pulled 7,5 – 8 mio viewers (still withoud lead-in), while in 4th season it did not do well (they gave it a lead-in – TSCC :S), because of that stupid show TSCC. So, yeah, Prison Break was doing ALOOOT better then Fringe, because it was also No. 1 show in Europe and Japan (and it’s still is) and is one of the most-talked about shows, which I highly doubt all that will happen to Fringe…
“Fringe going from 13.206 million and a 5.2/12 the first half hour to 10.975 million”
That seems pretty bad when millions of people just drift away. I don’t blame them but shouldn’t FOX be pissed?
For the love of everything holy, why can you not let New Amsterdam die already? It’s been dead for quite some time already, and whining about how you think Reilly shafted it is getting annoying. I’ve already given two examples (series premiere and repeat) of Fringe doing fine without leadins, which is better than New Amsterdam can say for pulling in 6 million in new episodes on its own (especially considering all the promos it got). Although I’m sure in another few months, when FOX gives another new show a leadin and it does moderately well, we’ll be having this same discussion again…
Actually, they’re just doing 3 hours the first week and then 2:30 regular. Only 10% of their primetime.
Vader:
Are you asking Robert, because I definitely did NOT bring up NA.
Fringe finished 3rd in it’s time slot behind giggest loser and Mentalist (repeat0
WOW Fringe is really sucking in ratings despite such a Huge Lead in
Fringe on it’s own would hardly get 5-6 million viewers because it is not a great Quality show just another JJ abrams Hyped to the Death show
*correction ; Biggest
NBC’s gold is The Biggest Loser! I can’t believe it!
Andrea: I don’t know who I’m asking, but I’m pretty sure that we’ve had this discussion once before already, can we just move on?
Vader: SP: 9.13 million, 3.2/9 demo. One week prior to the premieres of NCIS and TM and The Biggest Loser. Not great premiere numbers on a night with no competition.
Dexter, you have a source of Prison Break being #1 in Japan and Europe? I think the most watched shows on the world are CSI: Miami, Lost and Desperate Housewives.
LOL any BAD or Mediocre Shows will get double digit ratings if paired with American Idol
Fringe is a show which cannot Stand on it’s own , if not for AI and House Lead ins This Show would have been on the cancellation list with the Knight rider LOL
You know, I don’t know why I bothered coming up with an example. I should’ve known that it would be dismissed outright. You just see what you want to see. Did you bother looking up the repeat on that Sunday? Of course, I’m sure there was a reason it did so well, like no competition, because nobody would actually watch that show if it had no leadin or plenty of competition, right? *rolls eyes*
Can anyone explain the surge in new viewers this season for NCIS? Last season, it was ranked 14th in total viewers, but a measly 62th in the 18-49 demo.
Jeffrey: You must be joking, Fringe pulls in repeats, just under what Knight Rider pulls in new episodes. If you want to speculate about ratings, at least make a reasonable comparison. Fringe has shown me nothing to believe it would draw about 5 million viewers and sub 2.0 demo on its own.
Vader:
You should know who your addressing before asking, otherwise it doesn’t make any sense it ask it.
…doesn’t make any sense to ask it.
sadly Knight rider is not pampered like Fringe by Huge Lead ins
even with House Lead in fringe was getting like 7-8 million viewers and you think they could do this on thier own ?????
it would probably come down 5-6 million without any lead ins and Demos will be down too
Scrubs is slipping, pity the nights episodes where decent.
Chuck:
I’d want to say a lot people with buyouts or on unemployment due to layoffs with nothing more to do.
I’ve read that TV watching is up in the UK due to the recession.
Jeffrey, Knight Rider is on NBC. There is no where to put it that would compare to House or Idol. But even on a failing network like NBC KR can’t pull in numbers to even be possibly considered for renewal.
@Julio
i know that, i was just explaining with such huge lead in shows…. any mediocre crap will fair in ratings
I don’t know. Didn’t Til Death get the Idol spot in its first season? Or was that another crappy FOX sitcom? There was something that lead out of it that did nearly as horrible with it as without it.
You people really think AI and House fans are listeninf to Fringe? That’s a freaking big miscalculation. I don’t think papa, mama and little girlie who watch AI will switch to Fringe. Comon, be realistic a little The only thing AI is doing is boosting the first half hour numbers, so that the overall looks bigger to make FOX more money. Fringe with house has lead-in did something like over 9 millions for each episodes (maybe 3 episodes averaged 8 millions and one like 7.95)
The second half hour had 11.95 this is the real number. Because the first half hour had 1 minute from AI the 2 millions who disapeard are people that didn’t close their tv, or switch channel soon enough.
So yeah I still think Fringe on is own could average 9-10 millions. AI fans don’t care about a show making use of you’re brain. To hard to understand for some reality show freaks.
Sam, if Fringe couldn’t do 9-10 million post House, why would it do 9-10 million with no lead in at all?
Dexter, the whole “TSCC is responsible for PB’s bad numbers” theory was proven to be a load of BS a looooooooong time ago.
Lead-ins are overrated IMO.
And btw, my newspaper lists “Lie to Me” as airing AFTER AI. I’m confused. Is that just a local scheduling goof or what?
SAM
with House Lead-in They couldn’t pull that numbers how could they do it without it ?
Oh, and stop saying Fringe is averaging 7-8 millions, get real info.
1.01 9.132
1.02 13.272
1.03 9.422
1.04 9.906
1.05 9.157
1.06 8.914
1.07 8.612
1.08 9.175
1.09 7.704
1.10 8.535
1.11 12.1
1.12 12.09
Don’t really look like 7-8 to me
Scrubs has outstayed its welcome in quality and ratings. I hope they don’t bring it back next year, let the cast and the creators work on something new. How can only CBS create a successful sitcom? I know that the office is successful, but they still can’t build a successful block around it like CBS can. (simpsons/family guy don’t count either because they’re holdovers from an earlier era)
LOL so that looks like 8-9 average what’s the big difference ? and that was with House and AI lead in
i am talking how will it fair that much on it’s own ????
it would get around PB numbers
I like Fringe, and I think it’s getting better. But Fringe doesn’t require any brain power. It doesn’t strain the brain. I just happen to like freaky make believe crap set into a “but what if it were TRUE!?” environment. It’s not for everyone, but it doesn’t have to do anything with using the brain, it has to do with entertainment preferences.
Fringe is crap
and i am happy people didn’t Sucked into that Hype
JJ should stick with LOST (That clicked well for him)
Sigh, the always popular “I like the show and you don’t because I’m smarter than you” argument… I always think that argument makes the person look less intelligent.
Robert, what I mean by using you’re brain is: That’s like lost, or 24, you need to see every episodes to understand the hole, if you miss, one, kinda get hard to follow. Compare to AI, or CSI where you can skip 3-4 weeks, come back, and still enjoy it. Same think for heroes, those kind of shows require a certain commitment to try and understand everything that happens.
I’ve watched a couple episodes of Fringe. I think it’s relatively decent. I haven’t really been following the show that much though.
JJ only did the Pilot of Lost, he’s not involved. Carlton Cuse and Damon Lindelof are behind the great show.
whole* not the hole…
Sam: I don’t think needing/being willing to make a commitment show is about brains. It’s about enjoying something enough to watch that much. while I agree with you in the case of Heroes and LOST (and LOST actually can strain the brain!), Fringe is more of a procedural show. you could skip several episodes and be not much the worse for wear.
Bottom line is, Fringe is in no danger of cancellation. Why do you feel the need to defend it so much, Sam?
what the hells going on herE? Bashing Fringe? for what?
dont like it? dont watch it. its a high quality show, and in 18-49 its friggin strong with or without idol.
Serialized shows don’t require more brain power than episodic shows just by the virtue of being serialized. You can’t jump into book 6 of Harry Potter without being rather lost, but that doesn’t mean it requires more brains to read than The Count of Monte Cristo, which is a stand-alone book, or a 2-page article in a medical journal.
cool, I am from Europe, so… and I read about Japan, if I find a link, I’ll posted.
I’m from Europe too, and here(hungary, a country of 10M+) Prison Break rated much lower than a repeat of NCIS against it, in fact in the first season it used to be a top3 show, but with the second season any repeat of any show could beat it…
I will appreciate the link, thanks.
I know that UK pay 28 million for the rights of the fifth season of Lost.
what I was trying to say is that PB is no way a #1 show in Europe (well at least in my country
)
Julia, well, it seems like to me there is a lot of Fringe bashing in here. Each time a read the comments it’s kind of the same thing, don’t know why though. Was the same thing for Heroes. So why not having the other side of the medal ^^
As for the top watched show in other country, no clue, the only time I heard numbers here in Canada, it was for 24. 4 millions for the premiere. I think that’s pretty big for us. In % that’s better than the US ratings. but I don’t know any site monitring our ratings.
Something about FOX’s strategy just doesn’t work for me. Idol, 24, and House are the only two shows this network can count on–the rest depend on their lead-ins. So technically, FOX has built a three-day schedule but ends up struggling for the next four days. Remove Idol, and FOX is a deathbed, looming with low-rated garbage. Someone has to fix this strategy and quick.
NBC is doing excellent with The Biggest Loser. For some reason, older reality shows are making big comebacks (The Bachelor anyone?) while newer ones are struggling.
15 million for a Mentalist repeat? Who are these people? I don’t watch repeats of any show and while I do watch The Mentalist when it’s new, I can’t imagine that THIS many people would watch a repeat.
jesus_stick, that’s cause people are stupid and would rather watch the same shit over and over again.
And The mentalist is getting on my last damn nerve.
How does The Mentalist do so well in rerun?
It’s a new show with a lot of buzz…and is growing in viewers each week! To a lot of new viewers, they hadn’t yet seen the episode. Like other CBS shows, I’m sure it will repeat well down the road, but not like it’s doing now.
Even Lost episodes repeated well during the first season. That’s pretty amazing considering that a repeat last saturday drew less than 3 million viewers.
I believe one question on here was asking if any show with an AI lead-in bombed, and the answer is yes! I wish I could say that it was Til Death, but unfortunately, that show did well after it.
However, Wedding Bells bombed pretty horribly after American Idol, proving that AI fans won’t stay with just ANY show.
I don’t HATE Fringe. I think it has some good stuff going for it (at least, for its ratings’ sake: 1)Well-known creator & writers, 2)It’s a procedural cop-esque program, 3)You don’t HAVE to have seen the previous episode to know what’s going on, which actually keeps some coming back every week.
But yeah, Wedding Bells bombed after AI. I believe the first post-Idol didn’t do horribly; but by the next post-Idol spot did much worse.
I wish I could see the 50+ demo for NCIS and The Mantalist, they’re easily #1 and #2 in the category. Unless there’s a huge under 18 audience that no one knows about.
I haven’t watched the Mentalist myself just yet, but it’s on my DVR playlist. I don’t know, but it doesn’t look all that appealing to me. Since it’s so popular, I’ll give it a try eventually.
Remembering how long ABC inexplicably renewed According To Jim because of it’s syndication value, I wouldn’t be calling Scrubs dead yet people. Life support, sure, but not dead.
Shane, Bones does just fine on FOX as well. Sundays, while they’ve been dipping lately, are usually strong in the demos. So they have 4.5 days that do just fine.
FRINGE does extremely well in C3 rankings. So it’s not in any trouble at all. It’s just not that good imho. It hasn’t had a good episode yet that I’ve watched (and I’ve seen them all). It just keeps plowing away in the average to above average entertainment category.
For a AI experiment and a HOUSE Lead in, I’d say it’s a slight disappointment. LIE TO ME did slightly better and they have to be hoping for a similar result tonight as last week, if not better.
The FRINGE results are letting FOX consider premiering DOLLHOUSE on a Tuesday now for one week to give the show a kick start. Which they should do, but still may not because JJ will throw a tantrum.
haha@ JJ will throw a tantrum. Though it makes a ton of sense that FOX would banish Dollhouse to Fridays, it makes no sense to me at all why they wouldn’t give it a kick start once on a Tuesday or Wednesday before 2/13. If they did it on Tuesday, in the grand scheme it would only be shorting Fringe out of one airing of a REPEAT.
I’m wondering if FOX thinks Dollhouse is so bad it doesn’t want to give it more exposure.
I’m wondering if FOX thinks Dollhouse is so bad it doesn’t want to give it more exposure.
That’s the impression I get. I’m really curious to see if any Whedon fans will own up to the quality of the show after seeing it. (Assuming it really is as bad as it’s rumored to be, that is.)
Robert, they’re acting like the show is GOOD to the marketing world. Usually you get a feel if the show is supposed to be bad, they claim the delay was from finding out a few changes made the show work a lot better. Whedon has repeated those claims that the changes made the show not just better but much better. I’m supposed to see the pilot next week…
It would make sense to give it a quick kick start with AI and see if any of those fans follow the show to Friday. Otherwise it’s stuck with Whedon fans which number around 3M base viewers and Dushku fans which also huddle around the same number and likely both viewers are the same in many cases. It’s not enough with TSCC as a lead in for much hope unless they market the hell out of it, and that includes using Idol to showcase it.
Again the 12M number is low enough to justify that showcase. However the politics going on right now about it is amusing. You got one side that believes in the show thinking they can pull that same 12M or more for the first episode. Then you got the side that doesn’t want it around (for whatever reason) thinking it WILL get 12M viewers for the pilot, so if it tanked on Fridays there would always be the argument that if it had the FRINGE treatment it would do just as well. So you have two opposing forces at FOX when it comes to DOLLHOUSE. It is also doing the short commercial thing, and that means $$$$$$ to FOX. The commercials for FRINGE go much higher than they normally would for a show with its ratings, because people WATCH the commercials. So FOX should treat DOLLHOUSE well from the start.
There is a whole group at FOX who are convinced they can make SCI FI Friday work and slowly build an audience and they point to X-FILES as their proof it can work.
@Nick C,
You hit the case for Fringe dead-on with the C+3 ratings. It’s got excellent (as in 100%-ish) commercial viewing retention. As for whether it’s “good” or not, you have your opinion and you are welcome to it
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I wonder if there will be some Joss Whedon/JJ Abrams bickering over “Fringe got the cushy lead in, and I got the death slot!” As a previous poster noted with X-Files: if your show is THAT good to enough people, you’ll build viewers and succeed, even on a Friday. Judging by all the pre-show buzz about reworks, rewrites, and general chaos in producing Dollhouse… it may not be THAT good to very many people. Buffy fans and Eliza fans may not make a big enough audience to overcome the chaotic vibe that already inhabits the series.
Saw a promo for “Dollhouse” last night during Nip/Tuck on FX. It doesn’t just look bad…..it looks really f#@king bad! My prediction (assuming Fox doesn’t premeire it after AI)…3.3 million viewers and a 1.2 in the demo. Crash and burned after 2 airings is my guess!!!!
Joss Whatsisface is really overrated if you ask me. Other than Buffy, what the hell has he really done? Firefly was a bust, as was its venture to the big screen. I just don’t get Hollywood sometimes. I’m tired of hearing his name thrown around as if he were Aaron Spelling or something.
JT:
Speaking personally, I never got Buffy either.
Wow…… NCIS gets almost 20 million people…. thats just wrong. Seriously, I hate that show. IDK how CBS gets high numbers for all these mediocre/bad shows. The mentalist gets 15 mil for a repeat.. House JUST got 15 million for the first time this season and it was a new episode. This is just wrong.
As much as I am a big fan of Fringe, It is surviving on lead-ins, which is not a bad thing honestly. Whatever gets you ratings huh. and If your Show gets 12 to 10 million viewers, Thats nothing to complain about. NBC wishes they had numbers like those for there scripted programs.
Amidst the Agincourt-like melee, glimmers of penetrating light from the swords of the Well-Informed. I need to do some quick boning up on C3 and the source for basic cable post-nine central age and gender breakdowns. The dropoff in 18-49 viewers on Tuesday night – presumably they go to cable, is noticable and may motivate me to get off my happy *** and do some ciphering.
Again, I think the C3 ratings for Fringe says a lot more about the limited commercial experiement than it does about the show itself.
I wonder if it’s possible to talk a show into cancellation, because that’s what seems to be happening with DOLLHOUSE. I find it really funny that people are calling it bad and saying that it’s going to be terrible when the show hasn’t even premiered yet.
I’ll do the normal thing and watch the show before judging it.
If everyone here did the normal thing, it’d be pretty boring. :p
Ethan: you may rethink that when if you saw the promo I did. I pretty much can guarantee that it’s done for after seeing that. But go ahead and watch with the 10 or so others who have a big hardon for Joss Whedon.
Does anyone have a youtube link to this promo in question?
Nielsen viewers are CBS flunkies. They will apparently watch any police procedural, but won’t give anything else a chance. Thus making CBS with their disposable income buy interesting out-of-the-box shows just so they can trash them after either 3 episodes or half a season. Millions of people don’t watch these shows. It’s about the Nielsens. They dictate what the TV industry’s advertisers are supposedly looking for. There are NOT a million Nielsen viewers in the U.S. Only a select few thousand. Give it a rest! Millions.
Lynn, Let me guess, you’re bitter that Swingtown completely tanked and rather than just accept that others simply did not like the show, you feel the need to attack and degrade them to make yourself feel better.
^ Curious. I thought all Nielsen viewers were mutant space monkeys.
Holly, no love for Moonlight and Jericho?!?
All the promos for DOLLHOUSE are bad. They are basically “here’s a hot girl, watch hot girl shoot things”. But how can you base a show’s chances of survival on that? Those promos are what FOX does best: show a bunch of action and half naked girls…get the ratings.
I LOVE Fringe. Great show. Most of the public dosen’t want to be challanged with something smart and different! O’well!
Chuck
Robert, You’re right, my apologies to the bitter fans of those two shows as well (not that all the fans of the shows are bitter, I wouldn’t want to generalized based on internet postings).
my opinion is that idol will go up to around 30 million again once the live shows start in a couple of weeks
what i think is sad is that both 90210 and Privileged get lower ratings than American Idol and Fringe in CANADA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! im guessing that not only American networks is the CW’s main competition, CTV is now one too! American Idol in Canada gets around 2.0-3.0 million viewers and Fringe gets 1.4-1.6 million viewers yet the CW cant get 3 million viewers??? There are less people in Canaa and they are still beating the CW’s butts in viewers!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Fringe is sometimes a stand alone series and a serial. Last night’s episode, you could’ve watched without seeing anything before that. The last two before that? Not so much. It depends on whenever they decide to show the bigger picture, instead of these isolated incidents of The Pattern.
AI only hit 30 million 3 times last season (the first two episodes and the finale), and it barely hit 30 million for the premiere this year. What makes you think it will suddenly jump up when the live show starts when (to my knowledge) that hasn’t been the case before?
Vader: I think they’re doing with Fringe like what was done with X-Files, where there’s a lot of stand alone episodes (wtf happened to these people kind of episodes) and then episodes that further the overarching mythology (the Pattern).
I for one am a fan and am glad the ratings are positive whether it’s because of House and American Idol or not. It doesn’t matter to me.
Julia: You said waaaaay at the top of this posting that you don’t expect to see Without a Trace back next season. Honestly, I would be very surprised if it isn’t considering CBS’s previous luck with the Tue @ 10 time slot.
I think Idol will definitely go up to a 29-30 million show again in a few weeks time when the competition starts.
Lead ins or no lead ins…I’m still gonna watch Fringe.
No need to bash Fringe. Others love the show and I’m one of them.
The idea behind DOLLHOUSE is actually rather wicked. The idea that a group of people are kept in a facility and have their memory whiped after every mission and then reprogrammed before new missions COULD be rather entertaining. The people paying for the “dolls,” could have just about any agenda. For SCI FI purposes this show has a lot of promise just from the premise. Of course because it’s SCI FI it can easily be screwed up too.
Mike, we’ll see, but CBS has too many shows that are doing too well to be canceled. Without a Trace is not doing so great (I would have to check the Renew/Cancel Index, but I think it’s right at the borderline) and is losing a large lead-in. These mythical jinxed timeslots is not a theory I buy into. CBS has not found something that works there, and considering how Without a Trace is doing, still hasn’t quite found it.
Nick C, the premise of Dollhouse could be interesting indeed. The execution is the key…and from pre-show buzz, so far the execution is haphazard at best.
Mike G, I totally agree with you regarding WAT. Regardless of its older-skewing demos, WAT is the only series in YEARS to crack the magic 10-million viewer mark for CBS in the Tuesday at 10 time slot. The only way WAT will be canned is if CBS wants to risk a bigger established show – like NCIS – and see if it can hold that timeslot. I highly doubt they’ll risk it. IMHO, WAT was placed in that time slot with full expectation of its demise. CBS did not expect the ratings they are seeing with WAT – and they’re pleasantly surprised, no doubt!
And Holly, thanks for noting that not all fans are bitter
. As a Jericho fan, I am not bitter. I do believe Jericho was a great show on the wrong network. Heck, even it’s 6-million viewers for the short second season could be a success on NBC! Cost may have been the true deciding factor on Jericho, IMHO. It cost too much to garner any less than 10MM viewers for CBS.
Julia – with the “jinxed timesots” – I quote TV writer Matt Roush. The Tuesday at 10pm EST slot, for CBS, “has killed every show since Judging Amy.” CBS knows full well that nothing new can develop there. Their only shot is to pull established shows to that slot, and hope the audience follows. With WAT, most of it did indeed follow. Depending on how much salary Garcia and company demand, WAT will not go anywhere unless CBS moves NCIS or a CSI to the 10 p.m. slot. I’d be shocked if they try anything new there, that’s for sure! Although with the NBC Leno announcement, and no more Boston Legal in contention, the situation has changed. Maybe CBS can afford the risk next fall.
Again, I don’t buy it, clutz. Shows that have been put there have not died merely because they got the Tuesday at 10 timeslot.
Scrubs is going to be cancelled isn’t it )-=
Julia, the time slot is not the only factor, but it is a definite contributing factor. For several years ABC’s news programming and/or Boston Legal, and NBC’s L&O:SVU were formidable competition. This is, in fact, the first year in what – nearly 4 years since Amy?- that CBS has broken 10MM viewers on Tuesdays at 10pm. Either every single show that was tried there was bad (Smith, 3 lbs. Cane, for example), or the timeslot is a factor. I think the latter position is more logical. Until 2009, this was not a timeslot where anything new developed very well at all.
I’ll have to double-check, but I’m pretty sure WAT was getting comparable-if-not-lower ratings in its previous time slot. Hence, my hypothesis is that WAT was placed in the slot-o-death at a point when death was expected. It’s great news for CBS that such death may be averted. The network will be taking a huge risk by putting anything else there, until WAT drops below the 10 million magic number. I just don’t see CBS as that sort of risk-taker.
clutz, I think the reason that time slot did poorly is because the shows since JUDGING AMY haven’t been good enough to watch. There is such a thing as bad TV.
is there a tv ratings website i can go to with posters that actually like tv and don’t enjoy bashing it?
Thank you, Nick. (I was trying to politic because I know Clutz is a Jericho fan.
)
Julia, ah but I think JERICHO did well enough in the time slot at the start. It just lost ratings as the season progressed. There are arguments about CBS not promoting it well enough (especially when it came back) since it was a serial and not a show you wanted to miss an episode of. JERICHO was good TV, just not right for the network it was on. It would probably still be on the air if it had ended up on Moonves intended network (The CW).
Nick, so “Big Brother” is good enough to watch? It seems to get enough ratings to keep it around for more than 10 seasons
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Plenty of good shows fail in the ratings too. I won’t beat the Jericho horse again here…I’ll use, for example, “Freaks and Geeks (NBC)” and “My So-Called Life (ABC).” Those two dramas were critical favorites that just didn’t find an audience. The lack of audience does not mean the shows were “bad TV.” The networks couldn’t figure out how to handle them.
CBS has had trouble handling Tuesdays at 10pm for a few years now. Sure, those shows may have been “bad TV” by most viewers’ opinions. Still, CBS may have developed some risk aversion due to repeated failures in this particular time slot. CBS is closer to finding something that works now, with WAT, than they’ve been in years. I’ll be very surprised if they risk any changes there for at least one more season.
Thanks for your polite-ness, Julia. I do think Jericho and Cane fall in the “mishandled” category more than the “bad” category. Even so, as I noted to Nick, the multiple run of “bad” shows may be making CBS execs a little nervous to try anything new Tuesdays at 10 just yet. Next fall we’ll see WAT or a CSI in this timeslot, in my opinion. There’s no way they’ll move NCIS, given its performance versus AI this year. They wont’ move The Mentalist yet either. New is out, unless the Leno move has CBS more open to risk next fall than they were this year. SO WAT or as CSI it is.
I really wish my own TV was working tonight, so I wouldn’t keep bugging you all online
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1) NCIS is on fire this season! Go, go, go, little show that could!
2) Stop acting as if the fact that you do not know anyone who watches it, is in any way significant! There is nothing wrong with the Nielsen ratings, there is something wrong with the people you know.
3) Nielsen is not a company founded for the sole purpose of sticking it to Pushing Daisies fans! GEEZ.
4) The three most succesful dramas internationally last year were CSI Miami, CSI and House. Lost was never up there, not even in its first season. Where do you people find these numbers???
5) Fringe is doing ok. No more no less. People who are telling you it should probably have more with the hype and the money and the lead in, are not trying to get your show cancelled. Get over it!
wait, idizzle, do you mean to tell me that this website isn’t one big conspiracy against cult shows that struggle with ratings. It might actually exist to simply look at the numbers? that’s preposterous!
It’s a bit hard to fanthom why people who want to talk about the quality of a show and how much they enjoy it wouldn’t just go to a fansite. There they wouldn’t have to mistake any comment based solely on numbers as a potshot at their show’s quality or their own character.
I’m a new fan of NCIS. I’m 45, but my daughter came home from college and said several of her friends are obsessed with NCIS. I think what changed is that this summer USA started running episodes all afternoon. This is the first yr it is in syndication. Where I live it plays from 4 to 7 DAILY. It’s a character driven show, and if you like the characters you love the show.
Hate to disappoint you on #4 idizzle.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/5231334.stm
Not that I really care how shows do internationally, but I’ve read the LOST wikipedia page enough times to find that info and its source (yes, I’m a bit of a geek). There is some proof to that comment. I don’t see why it’s very significant though.
Jared: That does seem to be the case so far. I’m more interesting in the mythology episodes (like the one that focused on the Observer and the ones with the dude that’s sorta like Hannibal Lector). However, I thought the hand coming out of the computer last night was good in the freaky kind of way. I think it’s good stuff.
OK, I gotta admit I was wrong and there apparently was a fluke year with Lost in the top 3 after all, I however want to point out that those are 2005 numbers and my comment about last years most popular dramas stands:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/4587219a1860.html
Come on people, watch Scrubs!! It has been really good this year and let’s not let it be the last!!!
Timmy, this is the last season with Braff for sure, and quite possibly several others. It’s the last season with the original writers. Do you really want it to return as a completely different show that just has the same name?
90210 was a repeat, so we have to wait until next week when they resolve the cliffhanger (a main character getting into some accident).
However, are we sure 90210 will get another season? While it’s getting a lot of hype in the ‘Teen department, it was a show fueled by its parent show, BH90210. That is why a lot of fans of BH90210 started to watch the new version (myself included) but now that the wagon has ran out of fuel and they are getting rid of the original characters, I don’t know where is this show headed.
Really bad writing, inconsistent storylines, and I don’t know (Robert you can correct me if I am wrong) but I think this is the show with most breaks of any show of the 2008-2009 TV season premiering episodes like every 2-3 weeks.
What the CW is not getting in ratings, they are getting in Sponsorship. After all, the target of the show is the biggest spending group in the market.. female teens.
For what ABC paid for Scrubs, I don’t think it’s going anywhere. It’s a great show with great writing and great humor. With Braff gone I think they can do some tweaking and bring some new characters. The concept of the show stays, but it’s not so great now that the lead characters have gotten considerably old. If ER can stay 15 seasons on air, I think Scrubs and endure at least a couple more.
Pokerface, and the ratings have slowly dried up as the season progressed. It is now at VERONICA MARS numbers when the CW decided to not care about that show anymore. Of course they have a MELROSE PLACE in the pipeline so they may not want to axe it.
That is if Dawn has a job or network in June. Also teen females are not the biggest spenders, don’t know where you got that.
For what ABC paid for Scrubs
Um, ABC is the studio that produces it. Are you saying they had to pay NBC for it? Because that doesn’t sound right to me. And Scrubs is a show that is completely centered around Braff. When he’s gone, it’s a totally different show. At these numbers, ABC won’t be bringing it back under those conditions.
the numbers for american idol auditions continue to get lower. 25 million but not the same as 29 or 30 from years past. i think ai has three years left in them and then they’ll call it quits.
American Idol is a cash cow and cheap to make. Biggest expense is salaries of the judges – and they could be replaced if they demand too much $$$. They could keep it going for much longer than 3 years – unless the ratings plummet to 10 million or lower. I suspect most people watch the show for the talent, not the judges. Personally I cant stand American Idol and never watch it, but theres no denying its one of the most profitable and popular series ever.
JP, the third Tuesday show for Idol last year in the overnights (too lazy to look up the final rating) got 27.68 mil. Yes, it’s down from that, but it was not 29 or 30 mil. And the third Wednesday show was 24.14, so this is up from that, though we’ll have to wait to see today’s ratings to see how that really compares.
If the ratings were to drop at a rate of about 2 million a year, in three years it’ll still be getting 19 million on its third Tuesday, which is not normally the highest rated episode anyway. Hardly worthy of cancellation.
I think Scrubs has some breathing room because ABC knows it might take a bulk of the audience to realize it’s switched networks and time. Granted, I always know where my shows move to, but that’s not always the American way.
Also, syndication money has made Scrubs ultimately a bargain to keep. Hell, even if it sucks in the ratings, it will still bring in more people than According to Jim (which is horrible waste of airtime, but cheap).
People who own DVR’s can only record 2 shows at once, well mine can, and you have to have the channel on one of the shows. I forced myself through ABC not being DVR’d The amount of commercials when I watched Homeland Security was ridiculous, no wonder people DVR.
Malakhi, you need a new DVR.
Lol I live in the sticks in Northern Canada. I think I have a Motorola, probably their first DVR model lol. I am one of the few who likes Homeland Security (Real criminals getting busted at the borders) Knight Rider, which finally this last episode it has improved greatly IMO. Does the ratings include Canadian viewers?
Erm, my DVR works the same way… :/
Vader, you need an upgrade, too. Even my first DVR, back in 2002, which was a DirecTiVo (a really really slow one) allowed me to record two shows without having to actually watch one. But you can definitely get more than 2 shows at once now, though I don’t know what the max is.
Oh, and Malakhi, Canadian viewing is not included in these ratings.
I like NCIS, too, and remain hopeful its 18-49 figures will improve as its reruns grow in ratings on the USA network. I’ve actually shied away from American Idol, at least until they get it down to the final 24 or so. I haven’t the time to watch 2 hours of tryouts a week…
The finals have been posted on other sites now and looks like Idol had 25.539 million and then FRINGE was at 11.619 million.
Can FOX make that into a positive at all?
Somebody said: “WAT is the only series in YEARS to crack the magic 10-million viewer mark for CBS in the Tuesday at 10 time slot.”
There is no magical 10 million viewer mark. Advertisers don’t care. Right or wrong, they only want demos. Ageist? Probably. But it’s true. Total viewer numbers are almost purely academic. When a CBS show has lower demos then it gets less money from advertisers. WAT is getting old, so it’s getting much, much more expensive. Bringing it back for another season will cost them dearly. It may not be worth these demo ratings.
“When a CBS show has lower demos then it gets less money from advertisers.”
Ike, I’m not sure if this is the case with CBS’s 20 million shows, like NCIS and The Mentalist.
I’m sure the data is on this site somewhere…
I believe those particular 20 million viewer blocks contain enough 35-to-49-year-olds to boost the ad revenues. The 50+ viewers still don’t matter much to advertisers as far as I can figure. If those shows weren’t getting such strong demo numbers, they’d be gone. The “20 million” part sounds impressive but on a practical level, it means almost nothing, as I understand it.
Not that I am support of advertiser ageism (if that’s what it is), but it’s a reality.
20 million is a very different number from 10 million. It would be nearly impossible for a show to have 20 million viewers without having at least halfway decent demos. Much easier for a 10 million viewer show.
It really isn’t ageism, not unless gold costing significantly more than silver is precious metalism.