Everyone wants to know how the Dollhouse premiere did on DVR and to a lesser extent people want to know how Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles did on its first Friday.
In the case of Dollhouse, not as well as American Idol, Grey’s Anatomy or Lost, or even Fringe, but c’mon. Duh! Honestly the bigger story number wise for the week is probably that Heroes dipped below 3 million DVR viewers with a week’s worth of DVR viewing, and out of the top 10. It was already trailing Fringe and 24 in DVR viewers the previous week and it still is.
Dollhouse was 28th for the week in terms of total DVR viewing with 1.595 million DVR viewers, but keep in mind, even during a week that still had lots of reruns, 46 shows on ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC and the CW had more than a million viewers watching shows on their DVRs.
Dollhouse ranked 9th in terms of percentage of viewers watching on DVR, with 27.5% of its overall viewership happening via DVR, but it ranked behind Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles, which was 3rd by that metric with almost a full third of its viewing coming from DVR viewing. Despite this, Dollhouse still had over a million more Live+7 viewers than TSCC did.
Some will note that Dollhouse added another 500,000 viewers another half point to its 18-49 ratings when the additional DVR viewing beyond the same day viewing was lumped in. But guess what? So did Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles. And while I’m a fan of the Terminator franchise, and try to be a fan of the show (some weeks are easier than others), TSCC adding 500,000 18-49 viewers a half an 18-49 ratings point on top of the 230,000 .23 of an 18-49 ratings point who who watched TSCC on DVR the same day the show aired will not save the show. So while Dollhouse is in a better position than TSCC for sure, tossing those numbers around doesn’t really mean much to its survival, even though it is still fun to look at the numbers.
Update: there seems to be a lot of confusion in the comments due to seemingly (but not really) conflicting data reported by James Hibberd. James is looking at something we did not measure: the percentage (and that’s important to note) increase in 18-49 ratings points. We don’t actually have the ratings points, but do have viewer numbers and that does track with our data. Actually it turns out we do see the data, Bill has posted the weekly Live+7 18-49 rating for Fox in the comments on this post. However, percentage based increases are misleading because the shows with relatively few viewers overall, but still relatively good DVR viewing numbers show the highest percentage increases.
For the week, the CW’s 90210 had the highest percentage of viewing on DVR with 34.71%
To see past week’s Top DVR viewed shows click here.
Largest DVR Audiences for Broadcast TV Shows, February 9-15 , 2009:
| Rank | Shows | Net | R=Repeat S=Special P=Premiere | # Viewers (LIVE) (000) | # Viewers (LIVE+SD) (000)2 | # Viewers (LIVE+7) (000) | DVR Viewers | % of all viewing on DVR | % of SD DVR viewing |
| 1 | AMERICAN IDOL-TUESDAY | FOX | 21,736 | 24,971 | 26,999 | 5,263 | 19.49% | 61.47% | |
| 2 | AMERICAN IDOL-WEDNESDAY | FOX | 21,866 | 24,870 | 26,718 | 4,852 | 18.16% | 61.91% | |
| 3 | GREY’S ANATOMY-THU 9PM | ABC | 13,425 | 15,241 | 17,715 | 4,290 | 24.22% | 42.33% | |
| 4 | LOST | ABC | 8,217 | 9,888 | 11,862 | 3,645 | 30.73% | 45.84% | |
| 5 | OFFICE | NBC | 7,230 | 9,053 | 10,633 | 3,403 | 32.00% | 53.57% | |
| 6 | PRIVATE PRACTICE | ABC | 12,872 | 14,148 | 16,200 | 3,328 | 20.54% | 38.34% | |
| 7 | DESPERATE HOUSEWIVES | ABC | 12,382 | 14,031 | 15,635 | 3,253 | 20.81% | 50.69% | |
| 8 | FRINGE | FOX | 8,616 | 9,917 | 11,822 | 3,206 | 27.12% | 40.58% | |
| 9 | CSI | CBS | 17,093 | 17,976 | 20,206 | 3,113 | 15.41% | 28.36% | |
| 10 | 24 | FOX | 9,312 | 10,657 | 12,229 | 2,917 | 23.85% | 46.11% | |
| 11 | MENTALIST, THE | CBS | 18,518 | 19,711 | 21,416 | 2,898 | 13.53% | 41.17% | |
| 12 | HEROES | NBC | 6,825 | 7,920 | 9,709 | 2,884 | 29.70% | 37.97% | |
| 13 | NCIS | CBS | 16,754 | 18,016 | 19,497 | 2,743 | 14.07% | 46.01% | |
| 14 | CRIMINAL MINDS | CBS | 11,528 | 12,490 | 14,140 | 2,612 | 18.47% | 36.83% | |
| 15 | SURVIVOR: TOCANTINS | CBS | P | 12,065 | 13,633 | 14,403 | 2,338 | 16.23% | 67.07% |
| 16 | 30 ROCK | NBC | 6,748 | 7,690 | 9,033 | 2,285 | 25.30% | 41.23% | |
| 17 | TWO AND A HALF MEN | CBS | 13,980 | 15,025 | 16,110 | 2,130 | 13.22% | 49.06% | |
| 18 | CSI: MIAMI | CBS | 13,077 | 13,826 | 15,115 | 2,038 | 13.48% | 36.75% | |
| 19 | BIG BANG THEORY, THE | CBS | 11,870 | 12,733 | 13,814 | 1,944 | 14.07% | 44.39% | |
| 20 | MEDIUM | NBC | 7,309 | 7,938 | 9,192 | 1,883 | 20.49% | 33.40% |
Greatest % Of DVR Viewing for Broadcast TV Shows, February 9-15 , 2009:
| Rank | Shows | Net | R=Repeat S=Special P=Premiere | # Viewers (LIVE) (000) | # Viewers (LIVE+SD) (000)2 | # Viewers (LIVE+7) (000) | DVR Viewers | % of all viewing on DVR | % of SD DVR viewing |
| 1 | 90210 | CW | 1,956 | 2,409 | 2,996 | 1,040 | 34.71% | 43.56% | |
| 2 | OFFICE | NBC | 7,230 | 9,053 | 10,633 | 3,403 | 32.00% | 53.57% | |
| 3 | TERMINATOR: SRH CNR CHRON | FOX | P | 3,237 | 3,735 | 4,758 | 1,521 | 31.97% | 32.74% |
| 4 | LOST | ABC | 8,217 | 9,888 | 11,862 | 3,645 | 30.73% | 45.84% | |
| 5 | HEROES | NBC | 6,825 | 7,920 | 9,709 | 2,884 | 29.70% | 37.97% | |
| 6 | PRIVILEGED | CW | 1,294 | 1,420 | 1,836 | 542 | 29.52% | 23.25% | |
| 7 | LIFE | NBC | 4,133 | 4,628 | 5,755 | 1,622 | 28.18% | 30.52% | |
| 8 | DOLLHOUSE | FOX | P | 4,204 | 4,778 | 5,799 | 1,595 | 27.50% | 35.99% |
| 9 | FRINGE | FOX | 8,616 | 9,917 | 11,822 | 3,206 | 27.12% | 40.58% | |
| 10 | SCRUBS-TU 9:30PM | ABC | 3,826 | 4,262 | 5,213 | 1,387 | 26.61% | 31.43% | |
| 11 | 30 ROCK | NBC | 6,748 | 7,690 | 9,033 | 2,285 | 25.30% | 41.23% | |
| 12 | FRIDAY NIGHT LIGHTS | NBC | 3,119 | 3,472 | 4,142 | 1,023 | 24.70% | 34.51% | |
| 13 | GREY’S ANATOMY-THU 9PM | ABC | 13,425 | 15,241 | 17,715 | 4,290 | 24.22% | 42.33% | |
| 14 | SCRUBS-TU 9PM | ABC | 4,098 | 4,562 | 5,401 | 1,303 | 24.13% | 35.61% | |
| 15 | 24 | FOX | 9,312 | 10,657 | 12,229 | 2,917 | 23.85% | 46.11% | |
| 16 | LIFE ON MARS | ABC | 4,385 | 4,617 | 5,586 | 1,201 | 21.50% | 19.32% | |
| 17 | DESPERATE HOUSEWIVES | ABC | 12,382 | 14,031 | 15,635 | 3,253 | 20.81% | 50.69% | |
| 18 | PRIVATE PRACTICE | ABC | 12,872 | 14,148 | 16,200 | 3,328 | 20.54% | 38.34% | |
| 19 | MEDIUM | NBC | 7,309 | 7,938 | 9,192 | 1,883 | 20.49% | 33.40% | |
| 20 | E.R. | NBC | 6,826 | 7,279 | 8,540 | 1,714 | 20.07% | 26.43% |
The % of Total viewing by DVR table ranks which of the Top 150 broadcast shows [by Live+7 viewers] had thelargest % of viewing by DVR in their Live+7 audience numbers from viewers watching shows later on their digital video recorders (DVRs).
Definitions:
DVR (Time-shifted) Viewing – Program ratings for national sources are produced in three streams of data –Live, Live+Same Day (Live+SD) and Live+7 Day. Time shifted figures account for incremental viewing that takes place with DVRs which are currently in approximately 24.4% of all U.S. TV households. Live+Same Day(Live+SD) include viewing during the same broadcast day as the original telecast, with a cut-off of 3:00AM local time when meters transmit daily viewing to Nielsen for processing. Live+7 Day ratings include incremental viewing that takes place during the 7 days following a telecast.
Same Day DVR Viewers - How many people watched the show on their DVRs prior to 3AM the day following the airdate,
Live+7 DVR Viewers - How many people watched the show on their DVRs within 7 days following the airdate
% of All Viewing By DVR - Of the total viewing of that particular episode, what percentage was done via DVR.
% of DVR Viewing On Airdate - Of the DVR viewing of that particular episode, what percentage was done prior to 3AM the day following the airdate.
Nielsen TV Ratings Data:©2009 The Nielsen Company. All Rights Reserved.
While DVR viewings won’t save the show, they can’t hurt.
I hope fox gives dollhouse a 2nd season!!!
I was just reading the analysis at The Hollywood Reporter and it seems you’re not reporting these accurately. They list TERMINATOR as the highest gainer of the week, followed by 90210, SCRUBS, DOLLHOUSE, and PRIVILEGED. It’s really starting to seem like you have it out for TERMINATOR.
I hope that is not the case. I for one like the series and feel that their ratings are stronger than FRIDAY NIGHT LIGHTS, LIFE, and other series that remain on the air (and are under less pressure — FNL b/c it airs on two networks and produced by the studio, and LIFE b/c it isn’t on Friday). Respectfully, I remain cautiously optimistic that the series stands a chance at renewal.
the office does a great job on dvr. 2nd highest percentage overall with 53% of that being same day! thats what advertisers want if people dont watch live.
WOAH! 1.5 million extra viewers for Terminator? That’s pretty cool! Brings it to almost 5 million now. Just wish they’d actually watch it live though.
Why are DVR numbers and Nielsen numbers so incompatible? To me it looks like the DVR numbers are far more accurate or do they only monitor Nielsen families who DVR the show.
mark,
no you are wrong. We report the entire top 20 lists for both most DVR viewers and largest share of viewing by DVR, Hibberd at THR is just posting results for selected shows, not a complete list.I stand corrected. HIbberd’s table is based on demo ratings not viewers, I thought it was just selected shows. That explains the difference in the lists.Marc, I doubt Friday Night Lights, Life, OR Terminator will see another season.
Tim, DVR numbers *are* from Nielsen as are all the ratings on our site, or any others you see publicly.
i hope fox decides to give dollhouse a second season too.
and if they do they need to put an established show at 8 maybe hells kitchen or bones or even just house reruns. although i would like bones to stay away from fridays it would be a good fit with dollhouse and im sure bones would survive the move to fridays
So they only monitor Nielsen members who DVR the show?
Tim, Yes. Only the viewing of Nielsen families, whether live or later via DVR, is counted in the Nielsen ratings. The rest of us view only for our own enjoyment and not for measurement purposes!
Jeez, that’s not a good system to use. With the technology nowadays they could monitor everyone who has a digital feed.
Tim, see Numbers 102.
“TSCC adding 500,000 18-49 viewers on top of the 230,000 18-49 year olds who watched TSCC on DVR the same day.”
How many demo points is 500,000? And, what would Terminators new demo be with this 500,000 factored in?
The colours, according to Hibberd that took it from a 1.4 to a 1.9
Yeah mark, you’re pretty far off in your thinking…
1) These numbers are listed purely by numerical value, not just a overview of ratings like on THR.
.
2) Friday Night Lights and Life are as good as canceled. I don’t see the “if they can stay on TSCC should stay on” argument holding up past this season…
3) Friday shows have less pressure to perform than Wednesday shows. Often shows performing badly on Wed or the rest of the week are sent to Friday. Sun-Thursday are the major leagues for tv shows. More pressure, more competition.
4) Terminators ratings are not stronger than Life’s or FNL. FNL did better without even considering many FNL fans were able to see this “new” episode months ago on Direct TV or online.
5) DVR ratings matter little when renewing shows anyways
Hibberd is reporting that Dollhouse went from a 2.0 to a 2.6. I thought Dollhouse premiered with a 1.7? Where’s this 2.0 numher coming from?
I stand corrected, and have amended my earlier comment. Hibberd’s DVR list is 18-49 numbers, our DVR list is average viewers. While we now get 18-49 DVR data, we continue to report average viewers for DVR viewing for a variety of reasons including historical comparisons (we used to not get 18-49 data) and comparisons to the rest of our data (we don’t get weekly show final 18-49 numbers).
“We can all probably agree that business models are being turned on their heads and that new models must emerge, but right now, as far as what they will be, you should consult your Magic 8 Ball.”
Time for a massive overhaul. These people are using an outdated system that does not transfer well to this time. They are sueing people left and right for illegally distributing movies, shows, games etc. but they should concentrate on how to make that content available through online streaming with add revenues. You can measure anything properly if you go this route and not rely on 1% of households. That’s just ridiculous, no wonder the lame brain shows get the high ratings. Maybe the result will be the same but no one will ever know if no one ever tries.
Where I’m from they always use polls before elections. In those polls 1% of the the public is asked for their winner and the outcome is always different than the poll.
TSCC almost at 2.0? Even with DVR viewers, that’s still pretty sweet. Wish those numbers would influence FOX though.
Tim here’s the problem: the better system than Nielsen, the one that measures better and STILL tells the advertisers what they want to know – not just what was watched but WHO (male, female, how old they were, etc.) it doesn’t exist yet.
election polls, and certainly entrance and exit polls do not construct their sample/panels the same way Nielsen goes about it. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not defending Nielsen, just defending that when it comes to the buyers and sellers of advertising, they haven’t found a better system.
General DVR question: How long does a DVR’d program have to be watched for it to count? For example, most viewers probably watch shows like Lost & 24 in their entirety on DVR, but you can get through an American Idol results show in about 5 minutes. Does Nielsen count each of those equally?
Nielsen measures minutes of viewing so all averages we see are calculated based on the entire duration of the show. According to Nielsen fast-forwarding time during DVR viewing is not counted. If someone forwarded through all the commercials and credits for Lost, they will have watched the whole show, but only watched about 7/10ths of the show (~42 minutes/60 minutes) and would count for viewing ~70%.
If someone watches the whole hour from beginning to end, including commercials they’d count as 100%. If someone fast forwards through 80% of Idol’s duration (including commercials) 20% of the viewing would be counted.
As a special bit of data we don’t usually post, the Live+7 18-49
viewersratings for Fox from the week of Feb 9-15:TSCC numbers are on the order of the crime reality dreck on Saturday, and that was for the return episode, it has fallen since then. The show’s done. I still think it finishes its six episodes, but there is absolutely no chance it comes back next season.
AMERICAN IDOL-WEDNESDAY 10.33
AMERICAN IDOL-TUESDAY 10.12
FRINGE 5.01
FAMILY GUY 4.37
24 4.14
SIMPSONS 3.49
AMERICAN DAD 3.13
KING OF THE HILL 2.71
DOLLHOUSE 2.58
COPS 2 2.02
TERMINATOR: SRH CNR CHRON 1.89
AMW: AMERICA FIGHTS BACK 1.74
COPS 1.72
KING OF HILL-SUN 7P 1.59
AMER DAD SP-2/15 7:30P(S)-02/15/2009 1.59
40TH NAACP IMAGE AWARDS(S)-02/12/2009 1.4
whoops. those 18-49 numbers are actually 18-49 RATINGS points (out to two decimals, not millions of viewers).
Do’h! My record on this today is not good!
Oh man, so much data!
I think it’s painfully obvious that this web site has a bias against TSCC. You just can’t report that TSCC had a Live+7 increase of 36%, and finished #1 in % increase. You’d rather play with the numbers so your “Head Lines” of the shows “demise” wont force you to eat crow. This happened during the shows slowest, least action oriented shows. The next 6 shows are planned to be like the final act in a fireworks show… and no doubt increase these already amazing numbers.
1.) TERMINATOR 1.4 adult demo rating to a 1.9 = 36% increase
2.) 90210 1.2 to 1.6 = 33%
3.) SCRUBS 2.0 to 2.6 = 30%
4.) DOLLHOUSE 2.0 to 2.6 = 30%
HawkDsl, if you read the many comments, the difference is because Hibberd’s post used 18-49 DVR numbers while we use average viewers in ours, as we always have. TSCC is going away. If you choose not to believe that fact is up to you. My headline is in no danger of being incorrect. While Crow may very well be on the menu for me at some future dinner, it will not be because of TSCC.
@Bill Gorman:
A show needs to meet its demographic in order to survive, right?
TSCC’s demographic is 18-49 year olds, right?
So… our chances of gaining numbers in that demographic have taken a leap forward.
In other words; we’re showing FOX that we still have our audience out there.
TSCC’s chances of survival have risen, no matter how you might cut it.
Veran, if I have learned anything from the experience on this site, it is that hope does indeed spring eternal. There is no chance TSCC survives, but nothing I can say, and no numbers you will read will convince you of that so I’ll not try.
One of my favorite lines ever from Star Trek: The Next Generation (they may have borrowed it from somewhere else) was Picard saying, “Wishing for a thing does not make it so.”
Wishing for TSCC to survive will not make it so. But wishing that we could convince the wishers won’t make that so either.
You guys kept predicting that TSCC would never come back for a second season. Yet we did. You said we would never get our back nine. Yet here we are. You say, without any doubt, that we won’t get a third season. I say that our chances are far higher than you give them credit for. If our ratings can increase this much from last week’s (arguably boring) episode, then imagine what our increase will be when the brilliant episodes air?
Plus there’s Terminator Salvation.
Anyone whose seen the new trailer will know how brilliant this movie will be, so why would FOX pass up the chance to get a piece of that whirlwind when this show can reach a redeemable stature? Dollhouse and all those other shows may not survive, but TSCC has the benefit of a massive franchise to back them up.
Unlike Dollhouse, TSCC has far greater long-term potential, and no matter what you might say here; they would be fools to pass it up.
Veran, I am not trying to convince you, you are unconvinceable, but I just want to set the record straight.
I predicted that TSCC would come back for a second season. The words I used were “Guaranteed Return”.
I never predicted that TSCC would be canceled by January. Please link to the post where I made that prediction. Last fall my prediction was always that it would be canceled by May.
The most anyone can point to, and desperate fans have already done so, is that when TSCC was given its “back 9″ order this season I commented that I was surprised it had gotten it so early in the process.
The record is now set straight. Please continue in your delusions of TSCC returning next season.
I don’t make the mistake of pointing fingers at any particular individual, including yourself. I was speaking of the website as a whole. All TSCC ever gets is negatives and such and such from this site and others like it, yet the show pulls through somehow. I’m not deluded. I know that we may not get a third season still, but I take comfort in the fact that our chances look a hell of a lot better than they were. This ratings boost earns us time to grow back our audience, which I’m confident we will. If FOX were to decide our fate now, which I don’t think they’ll do, we would certainly get cancelled (unless WB offers incentives).
As it stands, I believe FOX will let the season play itself out, then decide if we’re worth sticking with. And like I said; if our ratings start to climb up to a much healthier margin, then maybe we can survive to another season (T4 being a big help there). I don’t care if you and the others on here have more experience in this than I have. All I care about is exploring every possible avenue for renewal, which is what a fan does when he loves a show like this one.
We have a high chance of being cancelled, that’s true.
But we also have an opportunity to earn a chance at surviving.
It’s 50/50 now, so it could go either way.
Ratings aren’t the only factors that matter to this show.
T:SCC was given it’s back 9 at the last possible minute, literally. The writers had already cleaned off their desks, and the writers room was shut down. Josh had to personally call back the writers, when he got the call from Fox 10pm on a Friday night.
But, I digress… Robert or Bill, 90210 does consistenly well in the live+7 numbers. How much did CW take this into account when ordering a second season? I’m wondering if WB would try to move T:SCC to CW, based on DVR numbers being it’s saving grace, like it is for 90210.
Veran, yes, we are evil Terminators from the future, since between Bill and I we represent 100% of the site, I can tell you with 100% certainty we are not down on TSCC, just its prospects for renewal. It’s nowhere near 50/50 — unless you mean 50/50 that FOX will cancel it this season before it even finishes its run. Another show, NBC’s LIFE (which I also like very much but will definitely be cancelled) had more DVR viewers than TSCC and it will still be cancelled.
TheColours, 90210 does consistently well in terms of % of overall viewing that comes via DVR. I’m not sure that is viewed as a positive though.
Veran, TSCC is the LOWEST rated show on Fox, both in the demo and total viewers, according to live ratings. The fact that it’s doing better than repeats and Saturday shows if you factor in the DVR counts for nothing. It’s not 50/50. It’s more like a 95% chance of being cancelled and a 5% chance of being renewed.
Does Julia not count then? Never underestimate the value of your copy editor.
Bill and Robert,
Since neither of you are Fox execs, nor can either you comprehend that T:SCC pending 3rd season is based off of more than live Nielsen numbers that you like to abuse, why don’t you keep your amateur opinions to yourselves? Neither of you are in a position to make absolute claims and the slander you spew against T:SCC is blatantly obvious. Your anti-TSCC agenda is as noticeable as MSNBC’s Pro-Obama agenda.
Here’s a newsflash for 2009: DVR ratings mater, and the Nielsen data shows that there is around 5+ million (live + DVR) viewers out there. No show is going to force people, especially young adults, to stay inside on a Friday night.
Julia counts, but since she’s not writing any of the posts that are aggravating the “hopes springs eternal” crowd, I didn’t want to lay any of it on her. I encourage her to write a post giving her personal opinion on TSCC’s prospects, but I suspect she has more important things to do.
Stateater,
This is Bill and Robert’s blog. If you don’t want to read their opinions, don’t come here.
Also, for all the bragging rights Live+7 viewing gives a show, if those viewers aren’t watching commercials, they’re not really helping the advertising rates, so they don’t matter nearly much in renewal decisions as the Live and C3 numbers.
Stateater — that’s what they said about Jericho, Lipstick Jungle, Eli Stone. But here’s the thing, when the Nielsen numbers ARE as low as TSCC’s, those other things really don’t matter, even though you wish they did.
Here’s a newsflash for you: the show is getting cancelled. even with DVR #’s, the ratings aren’t any good AND, the DVR numbers we post don’t matter — only the C3 numbers do (commercial viewing, with 3 days of DVR viewing as opposed to program viewing) but unfortunately we do not see them.
As far as no network forcing people, especially young adults to watch on Friday nights, that’s why we said it was really sucky the show got moved to Friday nights to begin with! The Lipstick Jungle crowd said the exact same thing, let me know when the next new episode of that comes on! Also you need to realize that 1.9 with DVR viewing which still isn’t good will likely drop to a 1.8 next week and a 1.7 the following week based on the last two weeks that are not included in these numbers.
What I find interesting now, is that TSCC fans who will not be deterred by results cannot see that those Live+7 demo ratings above compared to other Fox shows for the week are *terrible*. TSCC did worse than Cops 2 on Saturday night for god sakes, and barely beat the other Fox Saturday crime reality dreck.
Let this be a memorable moment, for there are 6 additional episodes remaining to be viewed and accounted for.
Yet it only took 3 episodes for you and the rest of your bandwagon to call the show over.
We shall see.
Stateater, I predicted it would be cancelled in May long ago. You just weren’t paying attention. You can still join the bandwagon though, we’ve got plenty of room! Yeehaw!
The people holding out hope for TSCC are getting harder to find. Even the most hardcore fan should realize that it won’t come back. It’s not like there won’t be a conclusion to the show, even if it’s only on DVD. Take what you can get, but don’t hold your breath about next season.
Wow, this is heated. I admire those of you who are holding onto hope, whether right or wrong, cause you have the same kind of heart I do.
Robert: That’s funny, I just watched (some of) a Star Trek episode where the Enterprise gets to a galaxy where their thoughts become reality. I skimmed the ep quickly cause it was really bad. About second season or so.
Hmm… a sci-fi show… 2nd season… some bleh episodes… bleh ratings… prospered greatly in the following seasons.
Never know.
So why again is there only one option with T:SCC, and that being cancellation?
Why wouldn’t moving it to another day/time for a 3rd season, be an alternative possibility?
Look at the X-Files. If it would have stayed on the Friday night time slot it would have surely died.
I think FOX would probably rather spend some time on their own properties, not just shuffling around a fledgling show.
Jordan,
If that’s the case, T:SCC wouldn’t have been given the back 9 episodes and FOX would have dumped it then.
I’m talking in the current time, not months ago.
The ratings really haven’t changed much at all if you factor DVR numbers. Plus those DVR numbers are somewhat smaller than the real number because 99.9% of people fast forward through commercials…
All the ratings have done is shown that Friday night is not a good slot for a show that targets a young adult audience. Fringe would have similar numbers as T:SCC if it was on Friday nights.
because 99.9% of people fast forward through commercials… Which is precisely why DVR numbers don’t count for much in renewal decisions.
Well if companies would just make GOOD commercials…
‘Nannerpuss is awesome though.
Holly,
Yet if you think outside of the box…
Say you have 3.8 million live viewers and then an additional 1.5 million DVR viewers. What is that when you add it together? Oh you say 5.3 million viewers? Interesting. Now if only we could get those other 1.5+ million people to become live viewers…how would we do that…oh you say move the show to a time slot that targets its core demographic best? You don’t say!
Actually, TSCC got 3.2 million viewers live, and about .5 million DVRd also that day bringing it to 3.7. Then an extra million watched throughout the week. I was wrong in my comment I made way up there. So the total would be about 4.7 million.
there are two tables in the post above, the Terminator info is (and always was) in the second one, but Rachel is right, it had 4.758 million viewers including the 1.5 million DVR viewers.
you can’t add 1.5 million to the Live+SD results because they already include some of the DVR viewing and it’s double counting.
Stateater, I spoke with an exec at FOX. He says the show is canceled. That make you feel better? Right now they’re trying to wiggle some more money from Warner just to keep it on to finish its run.
Also your reasoning is seriously flawed. The X-FILES became a top 20 show on Friday Nights, which is the whole reason it was moved to Sunday Nights. DVR viewership in fact matters none at all to anyone but PR for Networks. C3 matters, and TSCC’s first Friday C3s number were abysmal. It dropped .2 from its Live + SD.
Can I be the first to say that that seriously sucks?
But here’s the thing. Judging by the current ratings; yes, it’s cancelled. But you can never be quite sure what the future holds.
@ Nick C
Canceled? Canceled right now or do we still get the remaining 6? I know season 3 is not happening but I want to see the remaining episodes. I heard they’re gonna rock!
Oh, what’s up with the make you feel better comment? That is pretty rude.
I posted this in the wrong thread, so I’m moving it to the right place now…
Stateater, You may have something there with the airing on Friday thing. I wonder how TSCC would do on a night other than Friday….My guess is it would still be the lowest rated scripted show on the network and struggle to maintain a 2.0 in the demo.
Hey look, I’m right!
http://tvbythenumbers.com/2008/11/18/monday-chuck-beats-sarah-connor-heroes-down-a-little-more/8318
Bill and Robert,
I’m always checking out your blog and you guys do an awesome job at it. just wanted to say sorry about all the TSCC fans attacking you right now. They clearly have no idea what they are talking about as you both are fans of the show (as am I, even though this last episode was just gentle background noise for my sat afternoon nap.)
I just wanted to get both of your opinions on Dollhouse and if it were able to maintain these numbers would it be back next year? I’m really enjoying it and thinking it’s getting better and better!
Jsman, check out this post for that answer.
Reminds me of how they called Til’ Death as dead earlier this season. I’m not saying it’s going to happen, but you guys should admit that you’ve been wrong about this before.
For Terminator fans, here’s coverage of last weekend’s WonderCon panel! Enjoy!
http://tv.ign.com/articles/957/957908p1.html
Vader, yes, we were wrong about a 30 minute sitcom that SPT gave Fox basically for free to ensure it aired. We were also wrong about According to Jim. It’s a different world for crappy ratings with sitcoms. But we’ve never seen this extend to one hour scripted dramas. That’s not based on predictions, but actual results. In the case of TSCC there’s no reason to believe that past results don’t indicate the future. Unlike the case of ‘Til Death, where I understand why SPT is basically willing to give it to FOX for free (syndication potential), I can’t see why Warner Bros would be motivated to give TSCC away just to get it on the air.
Vader, I don’t think Bill or Robert have ever said the renew/cancel index is infallible. Til Death had special circumstances as was reported widely when it was renewed. Numbers alone can’t account for that. But logically, there’s no reason Warners would offer a similar deal for TSCC as FOX got for Til Death. The movie will be out of theaters by the time a third season aired, and what purpose could they have for keeping it around?
I can’t help but notice that Til Death still isn’t on the air, with no future plans of it airing any time soon. FOX may have paid, but will they air them? They were given a piece of syndication, and that may be all FOX is in it for. I suppose I should ask about.
Nick C, I am waiting for the ‘Til Death Independence Day Marathon!
Bill and Bob,
Considering I don’t pay a dime (nor a nickel, nor a penny) to visit this site, make all the mistakes you want. You always seem to correct them, and all the work you guys put into this site is appreciated. To hold you guys to a standard of perfection that even well paid, well funded publications that actually charge money cannot meet seems silly.
Just a little counterbalance to some of the whining. The internet is creating a generation of people who think they are entitled to free everything, tailored exclusively to their personal likes and dislikes. Sad but true.
I don’t sleep.
@ Nick C.
So FOX is trying to get more money from WB to show the last 6 episodes of TSCC? And risk getting sued by WB? FOX already signed a contract to air the last 9 episodes. WB could file a lawsuit against them for trying to get more money to show last few episodes. FOX isn’t stupid. If you’re such an expert you would know that.
Bite my shiny metal ass Nick C.
@ Nick C:
You claim to have spoken “with an exec at FOX.” Prove it. Other than being lucky with some of your predictions in the past, I highly doubt you have any connection whatsoever to the television industry. In any prediction, you have a 50% chance of being right. You’re bound to get a few. You seem to be just lucky in your predictions, leading people to believe you are in fact close to industry insiders. I doubt that very much. Stop making TSCC feel worse than they already do. We know the show isn’t doing well, but we don’t need some Internet blogger claiming to have insider information when he doesn’t. That accomplishes nothing.
TSCC wasn’t cancelled because how would it look to have a Terminator property fail right before a huge budgeted Terminator movie is getting released?
I love TSCC – and I remember reading a comment by Bill, I think, in which he said TSCC was one of his and Robert’s favorite shows a while back – but the numbers are the numbers and with or without the DVR viewers, they suck… bad.
It’s really not something to worry about at this point anyway. Just enjoy the show and let it play out.
?????? ….Maybe this is a dumb question…. ????
but, can some one please help?
Do all dvr’s count in ratings or only tivo’s or what?
I mean like… Do Direct TV DVR’s count?
cable company’s, Dish Network, etc.??? let me know thnx
All DVRs, Mindy.
mindy, no matter what kind of DVRs the ~20,000 Nielsen families have, their viewing is counted in the ratings.