| Scoreboard |  |
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| Rating/Share: Adults 18-49 | 6.4/16 | 3.3/9 | 2.7/7 | 2.2/6 | 1.7/5 | 1.0/3 |
| Rating/Share: Adults 18-34 | 4.8/14 | 2.8/8 | 1.7/5 | 1.6/5 | 1.9/5 | 1.4/4 |
| Total Viewers (million) | 17.49 | 8.21 | 12.88 | 8.61 | 4.39 | 2.09 |
As expected, American Idol driven Fox dominated the night, its 8.2 rating for adults 18-49 more than doubling that of the nearest competition (though NCIS was a repeat last night). With CBS airing two out of three hours with repeats, NBC took second place for the night.
It doesn’t appear that anything new happened last night to change the renew/cancel prospects for any of the shows that were on, so here are a few disclaimers:
1.) because of the data source I am using, some of the demo numbers might be off by a tenth of a point. I will correct as I get new data There were indeed a few shows off by 1/10th, but with additional data, I’ve corrected them (as of 9:10am PT).
2.) because American Idol had a four minutes of overrun (and a couple of those minutes were unplanned again) I’m sure that some DVRs recording both American Idol and Fringe got screwed up.
3.) for the reasons above, numbers for Fringe will go down in the finals (and Idol’s likely up)
4.) for similar reasons, due to Dancing With the Stars result show overrun, Cupid’s numbers (which weren’t good, despite retention) will go down in the final numbers.
Update: second half hour info for both Fringe and Cupid:
Here are Fringe’s numbers for the 9:30p-10p half hour (all Fringe):
3.9/9 (18-49), 2.9/8 (18-34), 9.763mm (viewers)
And here are Cupid’s numbers for 10:30p-11p (all Cupid)
1.5/4 (18-49), 1.2/3 (18-34), 5.408mm (viewers)
You can see past Tuesday overnight TV ratings reports here.
Full details:
| Time | Net | Show | 18-49 Rating/Share | 18-34 Rating/Share | Viewers (Millons) |
| 8:00 | FOX | American Idol | 8.2/23 | 6.2/19 | 23.48 |
| NBC | The Biggest Loser: Couples | 3.3/9 | 2.7/8 | 8.20 | |
| CBS | NCIS (Repeat) | 2.5/7 | 1.6/5 | 13.37 | |
| UNI | Cuidado con el Ángel | 1.7/5 | 2.0/6 | 4.48 | |
| ABC | According to Jim | 1.2/4 | 0.8/3 | 4.70 | |
| CW | Reaper | 0.9/2 | 0.9/3 | 2.05 | |
| 8:30 | ABC | According to Jim | 1.2/3 | 0.8/2 | 4.25 |
| 9:00 | FOX | Fringe | 4.5/11 | 3.3/9 | 11.50 |
| NBC | The Biggest Loser: Couples | 4.2/10 | 3.4/9 | 9.95 | |
| ABC | Dancing With the Stars Results | 3.4/8 | 2.5/7 | 14.76 | |
| CBS | The Mentalist (Repeat) | 2.4/6 | 1.5/4 | 12.10 | |
| UNI | Mañana Es Para Siempre | 2.0/5 | 2.3/6 | 4.99 | |
| CW | 90210 | 1.2/3 | 1.8/5 | 2.13 | |
| 10:00 | CBS | Without a Trace | 3.0/8 | 2.0/6 | 13.17 |
| NBC | Law & Order: SVU (Repeat) | 2.4/6 | 2.3/6 | 6.50 | |
| ABC | Cupid | 1.8/5 | 1.4/4 | 6.60 | |
| UNI | Aquí y Ahora | 1.5/4 | 1.5/4 | 3.711 |
Nielsen TV Ratings: ©2009 The Nielsen Company. All Rights Reserved.
Definitions:
Fast Affiliate Ratings: These first national ratings, including demographics, are available at approximately 11 AM (ET) the day after telecast, and are released to subscribing customers daily. These data, from the National People Meter sample, are strictly time-period information, based on the normal broadcast network feed, and include all programming on the affiliated stations, sometimes including network programming, sometimes not. The figures may include stations that did not air the entire network feed, as well as local news breaks or cutaways for local coverage or other programming. Fast Affiliate ratings are not as useful for live programs and are likely to differ significantly from the final results, because the data reflect normal broadcast feed patterns. For example, with a World Series game, Fast Affiliate Ratings would include whatever aired from 8-11PM on affiliates in the Pacific Time Zone, following the live football game, but not game coverage that begins at 5PM PT. The same would be true of Presidential debates as well as live award shows and breaking news reports.
Rating: Estimated percentage of the universe of TV households (or other specified group) tuned to a program in the average minute. Ratings are expressed as a percent.
Share (of Audience): The percent of households (or persons) using television who are tuned to a specific program, station or network in a specific area at a specific time. (See also, Rating, which represents tuning or viewing as a percent of the entire population being measured.)
Time Shifted Viewing – Program ratings for national sources are produced in three streams of data – Live, Live+Same Day (Live+SD) and Live+7 Day. Time shifted figures account for incremental viewing that takes place with DVRs which are currently in approximately 24.4% of all U.S. TV households. Live+Same Day (Live+SD) include viewing during the same broadcast day as the original telecast, with a cut-off of 3:00AM local time when meters transmit daily viewing to Nielsen for processing. Live+7 Day ratings include incremental viewing that takes place during the 7 days following a telecast.
For more information see Numbers 101.
OMG!
This is WAT’s best delivery in adults 18-49 for a while, and it had no lead-in whatsoever.
Wasn’t Law & Order SVU a repeat last night?
Kyle, indeed. Fixed.
Law & Order: SVU – REPEAT!
DTWS Results weak thought it would go up because of TM repeat. Interesting. WAT probably got off fence with last night’s number. Lead-in was repeat and this probably shows what it can do against Leno (since SVU was repeat).
Gotta love NCIS for having a repeat against Biggest Loser and AI rating higher than most highly promoted scripted first run episodes in the 8pm hour any other day of the week. I heart my little show that could.
Also what’s with WAT? Is it me or has it hardly ever rated this high out of new episodes of NCIS and TM? Weird.
Ouch at Cupid. A 1.5 in the demo with the DWTS overrun. Why ABC thought remaking a failed show would be a good idea, I’ll never know. Although the original Cupid was much better than this version.
Looking at Fringe’s numbers, it’s hilarious to look at that Yahoo article about shows that are supposedly in danger of cancellation and seeing Fringe near the top of the list.
Wow, Fringe is still beating DWTS and biggest looser. ABC according to Jim is being beaten by 90210, what a shame…
fringe only did good because of American Idol.
Chief, lol, that must be why some fans are crying each episode that they don’t want to see the show canceled… god those people can be incredibly stupid sometimes….
Chief, when I read that article I was wondering about Fringe as well. Makes no sense to me at all.
Yeah, the WAT ratings are… rare. This is the best ratings it has had. Why would that be? Was that like an special episode?
Note to Nina Tassler, Nancy Tellem and Leslie Moonves. Renew “Without a Trace.” Now.
I’m not sure Yahoo is deliberately trying to whip Fringe fans into a froth, but that’s just dopey. There’s no way Fringe doesn’t return, and there seems to be no way that Cupid will.
I’ve updated the post with the second half hour info for Fringe and Cupid since it represents only viewing for the shows without any overrun.
It’s WaT’s second best demo of the Season. Significantly, both were on nights there was either no L&O:SVU or it was a repeat.
As Bill has said the two programmes eat into each other’s figures.
Save Chuck!!! (just kidding
)
Yeah, I don’t know why Fringe would be considered on the bubble, either. Those are good numbers, and they are even better than last week’s final half hour (the part that Idol didn’t overrun)
CBS has a fairly potent Tuesday lineup, but it’s also an older-skewing lineup. If CBS is still on a youth movement, Without a Trace might end up being a victim of that, whether deserved or not. Personally, I think CBS is just kidding themselves trying to go young. Monday nights are the only night of the week I see them doing well with the younger crowd. (outside of Survivor, of course)
For some odd reason certain critics hate Fringe and want it gone.
Key demo in the mid 4’s and 11-12 million viewers is more than enough to keep it going. Heck, Heroes with 6.5 million and a demo around 3 is still getting another season – and with the move to Canada for shooting, the costs for Fringe have to be lower than Heroes – with its huge cast. So talk about Fringe being cancelled is ridiculous – unless it tanks to Heroes-like levels. Fringes numbers are similar to 24 as well.
Bad Robot, you are comparing a FOX show with an NBC show. It doesn’t work like that. Fringe is safe not because it’s doing better than Heroes, but because it’s doing better than most shows on FOX.
Actually Fringe’s numbers are better than “24″ (past Monday) and thats getting another season at least.
Marc Berman even jumps on the bandwagon noting that while Fringe “looks good on a paper” its retention out of Idol isnt great. Huh? ANYTHING following Idol would be hard pressed to get good retention out of the Idol juggernaut. Plus its #1 in 18-49 in its time slot.
The Dancing With the Stars results show is on tonight. Last night was the performance show. So, considering their ratings last night, does this mean that it is the first time the performance show has come in third for the night?
If so, pretty serious news for the producers.
Yes, NBC is a mess and shows that wouldnt survive on ABC, CBS or FOX have an advantage. Its more of a comparison between sci-fi genre shows than anything else.
well hope reaper has better luck on wedensday next week , Fringe is horrible i tried watching and stopped at the 8th episode , fringe is nowhere near as great as lost , oh well since jj abrams had nothing to do with it anyway
Alicia, last night was the results show for DWTS. Monday night was the performance.
when will CW renew reaper and end the horrible waiting game …..
last night was definitely the DWTS results show, or I have the ability to read news stories from tomorrow already:
http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/b118729_steve-o_done_seven_stars_still_dancing.html
ABC is trending down. This is good news for NBC.
batman, sadly CW’s is the very LAST upfront this year. But your waiting will be over by May 21.
Jack, ABC trending down is bad news for ABC, but it doesn’t make NBC look any better.
Batman The CW will renew Reaper if/when they (and WB) can find new producers they’re happy with, since the current show runners have now signed a deal with Fox. Of course that assumes they want to renew it. In theory if CW wants Reaper gone then the producers bailing is their perfect excuse not to renew regardless of the numbers, which aren’t great but could be a lot worse.
Last night was pretty much as you’d expect, I’m still amazed how well the CBS procedurals hold up in repeat – seriously a 2.5 in repeat against Idol? That’s pretty damn impressive. Biggest Loser also continues to hold up very well, it’ll be interesting to see if it can pull ahead of Fringe at 9 when the Idol over run is stripped out.
The biggest problem with the networks going over concerns the recording of a different channel’s show. If you are recording on one channel just record in a block and add time at the end. And always overestimate. I’ve noticed that some listings are actually showing the one or two minute overages and new start times in the schedule. The live shows are a problem but I noticed last night that Without a Trace started a little late too, probably because of Idol and Dancing with the Stars. I had been watching Stars and had the time set to record Rescue Me and the recording had started while Stars was still going on. It had not yet picked the contestant to go home. When Stars was over, I switched to Without a Trace and it had not started yet. It is all getting very tricky. Obviously CBS was making an adjustment.
It’s crazy how well The Mentalist and NCIS do in repeats! Are old people just senile and will watch WHATEVER episode is on at 8 and 9 on tuesday? I love the Mentalist, but still surprising to me
LMAO @ According to Jim.. wasnt this show was averaging 10 million like 3 years ago?
American Idol and Fringe did well as usual but the CBS procedurals did really well considering 2 of them were repeats and Without a Trace managed to build on The Mentalist lead in and the lack of SVU. I think it has a chance of being renewed although after next season I’m not so sure.
I’m enjoying Idol at the moment though I don’t think the four judges works well although I do like Kara.
those are odd ratings for without a trace I think its obvious that SVU hurts it when it is on.
I LOVE FRINGE!!!!
Take away AI and see how much Fringe will drop. You can pretty much stick anything behind AI and it will get similar numbers. The critics don’t like Fringe and with good right. It’s the crappiest of all sci-fi shows…well, okay not below Knight Rider but it’s pretty awful.
Too bad the crappy ones always survive…with the exception of Lost, that show is good.
Edit: I almost forgot Dollhouse, that sucks too!
Sorry to say this but i realy dont think Reaper will be renewed even if it gets better ratings, as mentioned the creators are leaving and one of the leads (Tyler Labine) have signed on as a lead for a FOX 2009 sitcom.
Btw if someone wants confirmation:
http://www.fox.com/futurefox/blogs/index.php/2009/03/11/filling-in-the-pilots/
Seriously, The Mentalist: boring. I still have to figure out what is the excitement about the show and the plot, besides seeing sexy Simon Baker every week
I like the mentalist but it’s depressing to see that it’s repeats get the same amount of viewers as house- my favourite show
Someone, it’s really not that uncommon for an actor/actress on a bubble show to take a role in a pilot just in case. It’s done with some pre-arranged agreement about what happens if both get picked up for the next season (usually that they’ll stay with the original show).
@ Holly
Yeah you seem to be right i found out now that another Reaper lead (Bret Harrison) was doin a show for FOX (The Loop) when he signed on to Reaper.
Julia: Thanks for taking the time to set me straight about last night’s DWTS. Whoops. Sorry.
Elliot whilst a repeat of The Mentalist may get the same/similar total viewers as House the demo numbers are worlds apart. In fact the demo numbers are usually pretty far are part for original episodes as well. And remember the demos are the important bit.
i dont think ABC even cares about the show According to Jim since its their last season. I saw no promos about it at all while watching One Life to Live.
Samuel.. not that i care about according to jim… (why is this thing still on?) but it doesn’t compete with 90210 and even when you compare the numbers it didn’t lose to it. i assume you were being sarcastic but i don’t know what numbers you are looking at. did i miss something? they matched in demo and jim had (still awful) 2-3 million more viewers.
The Biggest Loser really is an 18-34 monster… higher than Fringe…
I wonder how week two of The Unusuals will fare tonight. I’m guess between Castle’s and Cupid’s (finals). ABC is truely having a rough spring.
According To Jim’s valiant return scored the second lowest demos in the Tuesday 8pm time slot all season! (narrowly beating two repeats of Better Off Ted two weeks ago at 0.9/0.7) Yes, lower than every holiday special, Charlie Brown cartoon, all episodes of Homeland Security USA, an episode of America’s Funniest Videos, and even all episodes of Opportunity Knocks! Ouch!
Without A Trace had it’s 3rd best numbers of the seaqson last night (based only on overnight). The other two episodes aired against Momma’s Boys SVU and a special edition of Dateline.
Against Momma’s Boys (2.5) it scored a 3.2
Against Dateline (4.1) it scored a 3.5
^^^oops that should read Momma’s Boys, not Momma’s Boys SVU…
YAY for FRINGE!
People complain about “generic” and “uninteresting shows on tv, but when a fresh and innovative show like “Fringe” comes along, nobody wants to give it props!
Come on America..Fringe is a great show! If you haven’t watched it..get on board… We welcome you!
wow… NCIS (Repeat) 13mil… The Mentalist (Repeat) 12mil…
The thing with Fringe is that I believe the lead actress is just blah. I’ve watched this show and it doesn’t really appeal to me. I understand everything that goes on, but can’t just follow.
It’s remarkable how well Fringe holdsup in the last half-hour. Besides, it’s the new X Files. A lot of people complained about the X Files and Gillian Anderson when she first started out.
Funny how everyone keeps questioning on how if Fringe didn’t have american idol as its lead in it would fail, okay, put the mentalist after dollhouse and see how low those numbers are. God, TM benefits from having NCIs as its lead in but people start talking crap with AI being Fringe’s lead in?
Retentionistas don’t need to answer,.
t’s remarkable how well Fringe holds up in the last half-hour. Besides, it’s the new X Files. A lot of people complained about the X Files and Gillian Anderson when she first started out.
Correction: It’s
I like Fringe but don’t love it. I guess I expected more from the X-Files connection. I’ve already lost Pushing Daisies and Eli Stone and am sure to lose TSCC, Life, Reaper, Dollhouse and possibly Chuck. I’m happy to keep Fringe.
Kep The Mentalist would need to move network to go on after Dollhouse or Dollhouse would need to move network so it would be pretty amazing if that actually happened. Also I don’t think an NCIS lead-in is on quite the same level as an Idol lead-in but I can agree with the basic point that The Mentalist might not have broken out without that NCIS lead-in.
Personally I don’t buy the idea that Fringe is only doing well because its on after Idol. I don’t think the 10 million people who watch Fringe watch it just because its on after Idol and they can’t possibly change the channel – for them to stick with it they have to be enjoying it to some degree. At the same time I don’t know whether the majority enjoy it enough to find it if it moves somewhere else on the schedule.
Alex, I think Idol absolutely has something to do with the numbers. Look at what happened to Lie to Me when it lost its lead-in. Or look at how much House gained when it was after Idol versus on its own.
Alex, the worst FRINGE did was without HOUSE or IDOL as its lead in.
FRINGE benefits greatly from FOX giving it great lead ins.
Did Tori Spelling’s return to 90210 boost its ratings in any way?
Does anyone have that info?
Alan, yeah it had numbers that match GOSSIP GIRL and ONE TREE HILL as of late. So a success for the show. Still not SUPERNATURAL or SMALLVILLE numbers or even the numbers that 90210 was pulling when it premiered.
Nick (if I remember right) those numbers were also for its premiere some I’m not sure how fair it is to point to that as an indication of what the show can do now.
I don’t however disagree with the basic point that there’s some degree of Idol inflation (and House inflation before that) to Fringe’s numbers my basic point is that I don’t think people are watching Fringe purely because its on after Idol and that the people who are sticking with it are getting some kind of enjoyment out of it. Like I said I have no idea if they’re enjoying it enough to follow it somewhere else on the schedule but its incredibly simplistic to argue that people will just watch anything that’s on after Idol regardless of whether they’re enjoying it – especially when you make that argument about a weekly series. A one-off special like The Osbournes show I can see the merits of that argument but for Fringe I don’t.
I expect a lot of people were exposed to it the first time because it was on after House or Idol but I don’t think people stick with it purely because its on after House or Idol.
Alan there’s a CW press release on the subject posted on the site
http://tvbythenumbers.com/2009/04/15/tori-spelling-leads-cw-to-best-90210-rating-in-two-months/16793
Alex, then why do the shows lose viewers when they lose the lead in?
Why is LIE TO ME now getting worse numbers?
There is truth to retention. They teach it in school! The idea behind retention isn’t “hope,” but reality. People are lazy even with a remote control.
Are there people who simply watch the show because they were watching HOUSE or IDOL before hand? YES. It would also appear to be in the order of millions of people. I’m not going to suggest that all 9.79M people who watched the last half hour of FRINGE last night watched IDOL before hand (I wouldn’t even be shocked to find out 6M of them didn’t) but I do believe a fair number were there simply due to the lead in.
Did you actually read what I said Nick?
Like I said I don’t disagree with the basic point that there’s a degree of Idol (and House) inflation to Fringe’s numbers but I don’t buy the notion that people are watching Fringe every week just because its on after Idol if they’re not at least enjoying it in some way shape or form. People aren‘t that stupid. Fringe’s numbers are inflated going on after Idol because it exposes the show to a huge audience.
My over reaching point is that we don’t know how many people who have discovered Fringe because it was on after Idol or House would stick with it if it moved elsewhere in the schedule. And I’m not sure Lie To Me is an effective comparison on that point.
Oops. Thanks Alex. I always go straight to the Overnights.
I suppose I should start checking out the other articles on the site, too!
I don’t know why Berman keeps saying that The Mentalist is moving to Thursdays, the NCIS/TM is a perfect combo and both can reach 20 millions next fall. Also, The Mentalist is an older skewing show, I *think* there are some special ad rates for Thursdays because of the movies opening Friday and the networks need demo hits (Grey’s Anatomy/Private Practice and Survivor/CSI). The Mentalist is averaging only a 3.5 in the demo, I don’t know if CBS wants that demo on Thursdays.
Cool, if Berman is saying it will/should air at 10pm Thursdays, I could sort of see CBS trying that out. The Mentalist has noticeably outperformed 11th hour in terms of 18-49 season-to-date numbers and that’s with less of a lead-in, at least in terms of 18-49 year olds. The Mentalist is actually outperforming NCIS in terms of 18-49 s-t-d average. That could be because NCIS has aired more in-slot repeats, I haven’t examined the individual week-by-week data closely enough to know. But I can see what Marc is suggesting as making sense.
kep, I’d say you are pretty far off the mark.
The Mentalist has aired on numerous other days, via special broadcasts, and almost always ends up being one of the top scripted shows of the evening. Sometimes, it even bests NCIS. It’s repeats perform reasonably well, too. There’s no doubt that NCIS and The Mentalist are a good match, however.
Otoh, All you have to do is look at the ratings long term to see how Fringe has been helped by AI, and House before it. It doesn’t do well stand alone and it’s reruns perform rather badly in comparison.
I agree with Alex. Fringe is not going to drop to three million people and a 2.0 demo if you take Idol away as the lead-in. So why bring the lead-in up?
Lourdes: “The thing with Fringe is that I believe the lead actress is just blah.”
Anna Torv is just fine. She’s playing the part as expected – an earnest, not overly aggressive or experienced FBI agent thrown in the deep end of bizarre events. I find her completely believable. But then she’s also cute as a button, and I’m male, which probably is part of it. But she’s never struck a false note that I can detect.
People complain there’s no “chemistry” between Torv and Jackson. Guess what? The series seems to be trying to hook up Peter Bishop with Dunham’s sister. Not to mention that this isn’t the X-Files, and I don’t expect everyone to be placing bets on when Mulder and Scully get it on. Considering that for most of the series so far, Dunham was involved with a dead man, it’s a little hard to see how she would immediately fall for Bishop just to keep the X-Files die-hards happy.
“I understand everything that goes on, but can’t just follow.”
What’s wrong with this picture? The show is far easier to follow than X-Files was. Which is probably why the critics hate it – it’s somewhat simpler than X-Files and not as moody, so the critics don’t like it because it’s not “arty”. It’s a perfectly straight-forward sci-fi show.
Then we have the “scientists” (read: “geeks”) complaining that it’s “not science, it’s fantasy”. Apparently the word “fringe” is lost on them. It’s not supposed to be a hard science show. It’s supposed to be a show about weird stuff, and stuff that may not be scientific at all. Show me a science fiction show which is about hard science elsewhere. There aren’t any. It’s not easy to do “science fiction” about hard science, by definition.
The only problem I have with Fringe is with the last two episodes being stand alone after the hiatus. I don’t why show schedulers do this. The episode before hiatus had one of the apparent villains turn into…something and smash his way through a wall out of the hospital. The last two episodes have ignored that event completely. Makes no sense in terms of continuity of the overall story arc. Even Terminator did better than that – when they came back from hiatus, they at least addressed the fact that Sarah was shot, even if it was done in an incredibly badly paced episode.
But Robert, 10pm has a lower HUT level. I’m not saying Mentalist would drop to Eleventh Hour’s numbers, but I don’t think it would pull the numbers it does now.
Another issue the HUT level brings up: is CSI really that much stronger than NCIS anymore? I think it’s getting harder to say now that CSI has taken a significantly bigger hit this year than NCIS. CSI has the advantage of airing in the 9pm hour, but a disadvantage of having rougher competition. NCIS is the opposite, having an easier time with competition, but airing earlier at 8 with fewer available viewers.
At any rate, I don’t think the payoff (which I think would be small in the best case scenario) would be worth the risk of moving one of the only good demo-scoring shows CBS has had in a while to a new night and time in it’s 2nd season (and having to rebuild the newly stabilized Tuesday nights at the same time).
Would Fringe drop to 3 million and a 2.0 without Idol? No. Would it drop to 8 million and a 3.0? Absolutely. Does it matter right now? Not really, but don’t be surpised when it drops like a rock if Fox ever leaves it unprotected.
128 it might just be me but if I’m CBS then I want NCIS to lead into the NCIS spin-off, which means that either NCIS needs to move or The Mentalist needs to move next year. I think its easier to move The Mentalist because I don’t see where CBS has two-hours free next year for NCIS and its spin-off to go anywhere but Tuesday.
At the same time though I don’t know if I want to move The Mentalist to 10 next year although from what I remember it fared very well when it aired Sunday at 10 as a one-off so actually it might not be out of the question to put it at 10 on Thursday, Sunday or even Tuesday and see what happens. If it doesn’t work you can always shift it around again midseason.
For the record though this is part of the reason why I think the CBS up fronts are going to be much more interesting than people expect. There’s a lot of potentially big decisions for CBS to make next year in terms of what they pick up and where they’re going to put it.
HUT differences are overstated compared to 18-49 differences. Yes, 10pm HUT is lower than 9pm, but it’s higher than 8pm. The Mentalist is CBS’ biggest new hit, and CSI is CBS’ best 18-49 show. I could definitely see pairing the two together. Moreover, they may want to pair the NCIS spin off with NCIS. That too seems to make sense, especially given how Private Practice did when it wasn’t paired with the show it spun off from versus how it does now.
I can only see Mentalist moving to Thursdays if CSI is moving to Thursdays at 10PM and I don’t know if CBS will do that.
At least not right know but CSI will enter in their tenth season next year and for the first time ever (I think), Survivor beat CSI in 18-49 some time ago. And clearly the show is no the same without William Petersen.
Alex, i see where you are coming from with the airing the NCIS spin-off after NCIS. After all, there is no more compatible lead-in than yourself (and the next best thing is the most similar show).
However, I think the whole idea os spinning off a show is more to ’spread the wealth’.
The two obvious discrepencies here are Parks And Recreation and Private Practice.
Parks, however, could only go on one night due to NBC only airing sitcoms on that night. And barring them launching Parks AND another show on a different night, Parks would obviously take weak-link Kath & Kim’s spot.
As for Private Practice, ABC originally DID try to spread the wealth here, with medium success in season 1, but less than stellar results in season 2. Mixed with the inability to launch anything after Grey’s ABC resorted to moving PP to Thursdays 10 only after it’s initial plan failed.
But look at procedurals… CSI, CSI: Miami, CSI: NY, L&O, SVU, Criminal Intent, and even Trial By Jury all aire on different nights than their counterparts (although at one point Criminal Intent led into Law & Order– but this was done a la Private Practice… or only after ratings for both had deteriorated, and they were attempting to prop them up).
Additionally, Mentalist would almost assuredly lose viewers in a move to new night/time and maybe some ona potential move BACK if Thursday didn’t work out. And historically CBS is least apt to flip flop shows like that anyway.
That being said, it very well may be their plan to air them back-to-back, but i doubt it and don’t think it would be the better choice.
The fact that The Mentalist is replacing a CSI Miami repeat next Monday, it seems that CBS wants *younger demo* to watch the show.
The NCIS spinoff should go Wednesdays at 8 and do a ‘2 day event’ but it seems wants CBS will stick with the comedies so maybe will go Sundays at 9 to replace the tired Cold Case.
Holly: “. Would it drop to 8 million and a 3.0? Absolutely. Does it matter right now? Not really, but don’t be surpised when it drops like a rock if Fox ever leaves it unprotected.”
I don’t see dropping from close to ten million to eight million to be “dropping like a rock” unless of course it happens in one week. Even then, that still leaves the show with…eight million viewers and a 3.0 demo. Is that enough to get it canceled? Then who cares?
Remember, the only reasons the numbers matter to the FANS – as opposed to the advertisers – is whether it means the show will be canceled or renewed. I couldn’t care less what the drop is in a show as long as it’s not enough to cancel it or indicative of a trend that means it will eventually be canceled within the next season.
Looking at what CBS did before with the CSIs and the JAG/NCIS pairing, I doubt they are aiming to put the spin off directly behing the mothership, although I am obviously guessing here. NCIS/TM works well and there is little reason to screw with it. Plus CBS probably sees the humor in NCIS as their best bet for the 8pm hour, so the spin off might have to go there too. God knows that Criminal Minds would be better off, if the canned the second comedy hour.
And ABC put Private Practice behind Grey’s because their hand was forced. PP was croaking on its own. If that happens with NCIS 2.0 obviously CBS would have to rethink, but if they thought the only place it could succeed was behing the real deal, they would not have paid for it.
Robert, perhaps the HUT level isn’t a huge factor, but it’s something to consider.
And I suppose with Leno coming in, Practice would be the only competition at 10.
Still, I think the NCIS spin-off will air on a different night to spread the wealth.
Sundays at 9PM? move Cold Case at 10PM and cancel The Unit.
I’m sure The NCIS spinoff will beat DH at least in viewers but will go against Sunday Night Football and Sunday is their weakest day.
the128boy: it’s something to consider when not putting shows on Saturday night. And I doubt there is any chance CBS would move CSI from 9pm to 10pm. But it’s also not going to think, “maybe we should move Survivor to 10pm, it has a bigger HUT than 8pm!” What I think is that CBS will be putting something at 10pm besides Eleventh Hour, and I could see it making sense. However, iDizzle’s if it ain’t broke don’t fix it thinking as far as Wednesdays go makes sense, too.
Robert, oh goodness no, they wouldn’t move CSI to 10. I think that was Cool, and I just don’t see that one happening at all. And no they wouldn’t move Survivor ther either for several reasons.
And like I said, you have me pretty much sold on the idea that HUT wouldn€ make a whole heck of a lotta difference, but I’m pretty sure nets have taken that as a factor before. Didn’t ABC move back Lost to take advantage of 9pm? Perhaps to tentpole the night also, but I thought HUT was a factor. Anyway, ICould be wrong on that.
But my other thought is that CBS doesn’t like to move their shows a lot… and like Biggest Loser is rocking on Tuesday 8-9, so is NCIS/Mentalist. Even against Idol. Why play with one of your highest demo shows that stabilized your night.
I still think for the short term at least pairing NCIS with its spin-off is the best way to launch the series and introduce it to the existing audience. Although given the comparative strength of the CBS line-up it may not make a difference where they put the NCIS spin-off anyway. But like I said if I’m them I want it leading out of NCIS at least for the first few episodes to give it the best possible start. Maybe they should launch it as a ‘two hour NCIS event’ with the NCIS season premiere at 8 leading into the new show at 9 and then next week you slot the spin-off somewhere else in the schedule. That way you’ve introduced it to the audience, they can follow it if they like and you only have to delay The Mentalist debut at 9 by a week.
At the same time I think trying The Mentalist out of CSI isn’t a bad idea although my thoughts on that may change if CSI doesn’t rebound during the course of its final episodes this season. At this point CBS needs to find or groom something to be ready to take over that Thursday 9PM slot because CSI isn’t going to be able to hold that line forever and right now I think The Mentalist might be their best option. They need to work out where its going to build its biggest audience and put it there.
I really think CSI should move soon, maybe not next season but not only Greys is beating them, also The Office is having good 18-49 numbers. a Survivor/The Mentalist/CSI is a perfect combo but like I said, I don’t know if The Mentalist is too much older skewing for Thursdays.
Although I’m not a Nielsen family, I can attest to the notion that some people actually watch “Fringe” regardless of American Idol. In fact, I am a newbie to Idol due to its 9-minute overrun into Fringe last week.
Adam Lambert’s rendition of “Mad World” spurred my interest in the competition.
As for “Lie To Me,” its first pre-Idol airing fared quite well, but then it dipped. Last week, however, it seemed the Wednesday at 8 p.m. hour demonstrated very low ratings all around. This week, I think Bones is taking the 8 p.m. slot? So it may take a few more runs to find how well LTM can attract and maintain an audience.
Back to the Tuesday topic: WAT showed a great bump when up against an SVU repeat. I wonder if such details play any role in the renew/cancel decisions?
Alex, now that is certainly a good possibility. A two hour NCIS/Spin-off backdoor pilot and then moved after the first episode to it’s regular time. I think the hard question is, where can this benefit them the most?
clutz says:
“In fact, I am a newbie to Idol due to its 9-minute overrun into Fringe last week.
Adam Lambert’s rendition of “Mad World” spurred my interest in the competition.”
I briefly read that as “Wild World” (a la Cat Stevens), which actually has proved to be an intricate abstraction.
all of you people hate Fringe.
Cupid is dead! I knew its gonna flop!
CW is really awful! I think NBC is improving.
Shem, Tuesdays have been one of NBC’s very few bright spots this season. This isn’t improvement, it’s just business as usual.
ABC being more than fully a point behind NBC in the Tuesday demo IS bad news for ABC and good news for NBC. I think because most nights the 18-49 and certainly 18-35 group forsakes net TV at ten eastern, the Leno deal makes a little sense. Take all the potential NBC multicamera hits, dramas like Kings, which got good reviews, ( not Kings itself, obviously) and try to steal some mediocre CBS and Fox and ABC demo numbers at nine eastern. As for moving CSI to ten and splitting up Mentalist and NCIS, that doesn’t look like CBS’s history. NCIS and Mentalist even being on the air are tributes to a crafty, conservative policy of slightly jazzing up the geritol shows. The Law and Order franchise, except for SVU with its lynch the rapist and pedophile mentality, is skewing older than dinosaurs like ER and 60 Minutes even.