| Scoreboard |  |
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|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Rating/Share: Adults 18-49 | 5.5/15 | 2.6/7 | 2.4/7 | 1.7/5 | 1.5/4 | 1.1/3 |
| Rating/Share: Adults 18-34 | 4.2/13 | 2.6/8 | 1.5/5 | 1.8/5 | 1.2/4 | 1.2/4 |
| Total Viewers (million) | 17.13 | 6.74 | 9.43 | 4.29 | 5.68 | 2.36 |
There was an hour of American Idol, so naturally FOX led the night with a 5.5 rating with adults 18-49, with American Idol drawing an 8.0 rating and Bones drawing a 3.0 rating (and 10.76 million viewers) from 8p-9p.
Because Bones aired instead of Lie to Me, it’s hard to do completely direct comparisons to last week, but everything was up from last week, a bit, including American Idol. TV watching in general was up a bit from last Wednesday. Lost bounced (at least a little) off its series lows last week to a 3.9 in the demo. The second installment of The Unusuals dropped from last week’s premiere of a 2.1 rating down to a 1.9 rating. People said I was crazy for predicting the show would be canceled with only one data point, but now there’s two.
It’s still doomed. The Unusuals 1.9 rating still contains a minute of Lost that will be stripped out in the finals and The Unusual’s second half hour wasn’t very solid, averaging only a 1.6 rating with adults 18-49.
NBC ran nothing but repeats of the Law & Order franchise with the SVU flavor at 9pm sandwiched in between Law & Order episodes. The repeat of SVU outperformed last week’s season (and likely series) finale of Life.
Scrubs and Better Off Ted also improved from last week, but I’m not sure Scrubs’ 2.0 rating or Better Off Ted’s 1.9 rating are anything to cheer about, even if the performance was better than The New Adventures of Old Christine and Gary Unmarried. Normally ABC would surely gloat about this victory, but since the CBS sitcoms were repeats…
I’ll update this post with the full data table sometime before 9:30am PT or as soon as I re-watch Hurley try to change the future so we’ll have a world that never had to endure any Ewoks!
Update: Table now added. We hear the CSI:NY at 10pm was the lowest 18-49 rating ever for an original episode with a 2.8.
Previous Wednesday overnight reports are available for comparison.
Full details:
| Time | Net | Show | 18-49 Rating/Share | 18-34 Rating/Share | Viewers (Millons)2 |
| 8:00 | FOX | Bones | 3.0/9 | 2.2/8 | 10.76 |
| ABC | Scrubs | 2.0/7 | 2.1/8 | 5.30 | |
| CW | America’s Next Top Model | 1.8/5 | 1.9/7 | 3.76 | |
| CBS | The New Adventures of Old Christine (R) | 1.6/5 | 0.9/3 | 5.68 | |
| NBC | Law & Order: (R) | 1.3/4 | 1.0/4 | 5.57 | |
| 8:30 | ABC | Better of Ted | 1.9/6 | 1.9/6 | 4.72 |
| CBS | Gary Unmarried (R) | 1.8/5 | 1.0/3 | 5.87 | |
| 9:00 | FOX | American Idol | 8.0/20 | 6.1/18 | 23.49 |
| ABC | Lost | 3.9/10 | 4.0/12 | 9.01 | |
| CBS | Criminal Minds (R) | 2.5/6 | 1.5/4 | 10.51 | |
| NBC | Law & Order: SVU (R) | 1.5/4 | 1.2/3 | 5.51 | |
| CW | 90210 (R) | 0.4/1 | 0.6/2 | 0.96 | |
| 10:00 | CBS | CSI: NY | 2.8/8 | 2.0/6 | 12.01 |
| ABC | The Unusuals | 1.9/5 | 1.7/5 | 6.21 | |
| NBC | Law & Order (R) | 1.7/5 | 1.4/4 | 5.95 |
Shows are sorted by Adults 18-49 rating in each time slot.
Nielsen TV Ratings: ©2009 The Nielsen Company. All Rights Reserved.
Definitions:
Fast Affiliate Ratings: These first national ratings, including demographics, are available at approximately 11 AM (ET) the day after telecast, and are released to subscribing customers daily. These data, from the National People Meter sample, are strictly time-period information, based on the normal broadcast network feed, and include all programming on the affiliated stations, sometimes including network programming, sometimes not. The figures may include stations that did not air the entire network feed, as well as local news breaks or cutaways for local coverage or other programming. Fast Affiliate ratings are not as useful for live programs and are likely to differ significantly from the final results, because the data reflect normal broadcast feed patterns. For example, with a World Series game, Fast Affiliate Ratings would include whatever aired from 8-11PM on affiliates in the Pacific Time Zone, following the live football game, but not game coverage that begins at 5PM PT. The same would be true of Presidential debates as well as live award shows and breaking news reports.
Rating: Estimated percentage of the universe of TV households (or other specified group) tuned to a program in the average minute. Ratings are expressed as a percent.
Share (of Audience): The percent of households (or persons) using television who are tuned to a specific program, station or network in a specific area at a specific time. (See also, Rating, which represents tuning or viewing as a percent of the entire population being measured.)
Time Shifted Viewing – Program ratings for national sources are produced in three streams of data – Live, Live+Same Day (Live+SD) and Live+7 Day. Time shifted figures account for incremental viewing that takes place with DVRs which are currently in approximately 24.4% of all U.S. TV households. Live+Same Day (Live+SD) include viewing during the same broadcast day as the original telecast, with a cut-off of 3:00AM local time when meters transmit daily viewing to Nielsen for processing. Live+7 Day ratings include incremental viewing that takes place during the 7 days following a telecast.
For more information see Numbers 101.
well bones won the 8pm hour by a wide margin
well the comedies on ABC/CBS and repeats of Law and Order are not exactly good competition.
well i expected bones to win the hour. im also glad it beat recent showings of lie to me
WHAT is wrong with Lost???
at least better off ted improved a little but will it be enough? i hope so! wow the unusuals did bad!
Way to go Robert! NOW you can say that The Unusuals won’t be back.
I can’t imagine that NBC will axe L&O. An extra reason i havn’t seen mentioned yet is there reliance on it for repeat filler. It works o.k. in that department. Not wonderful, but o.k.
They have 6 hours of new/repeat of various L&Os this week.
Going up against repeats probably helped, and I hope that a lot of the people who saw Better Off Ted stick around in future weeks. I was surprised at how much I was laughing out loud this week (and last). It would be the perfect intelligent, non-laugh track, comedy fill for when Scrubs goes off the air permanently.
well that’s official, all the news series of ABC bombed LOL.
I can only see bringing back Castle and Surviving Suburbia.
Bones rocks.
L&O is definitely coming back; it repeats too well for it not to.
ABC must be extremely frustrated – they can’t even launch a single new show successfully. At least NBC has an excuse – they have no massive hit show.
It was kind of lame that ABC here in the Dallas area decided not to air Scrubs or Better Off Ted but instead aired Good Morning Texas After Dark in that hour. I don’t know if it was just Dallas or Texas as a whole but it was pretty stupid. Not only that but Scrubs will instead air at 3:42am on Sunday Morning while Better Off Ted not airing at all.
unfortunately for ABC, Better Off Ted is probably (though they are all closely clumped together in their weakness) their healthiest new entrant this whole season.
That is BAD.
Hi, long time lurker, first time poster. Is it normal for some shows to post higher 18-34 ratings than they do 18-49 ratings? It seems so counter-intuitive.
Bones really is the underrated hit on FOX and I’m glad it’s been given an opportunity to air all it remaining episodes. I think CBS should launch the NCIS spin-off in this slot and capitalised on it, it would do a lot better than the comedies.
CSI: NY does have a very loyal audience even with Criminal Minds in repeats, is there a reason why they aired a new episode while the rest of the schedule was repeat rather than wait a week and air a new episode with new episodes of the other shows.
I know its (still) childish but Lost being below a 4.0 again this week makes me smile.
Bones at least proves that Wednesday 8PM isn’t the complete wasteland its appeared to be the past couple of weeks. Not sure if it being noticeably ahead of Lie To Me really means anything in the grand scheme of things for Lie To Me but we’ll see. I do however wonder how Bones would have done against an original CBS line-up. I don’t think there’s any real overlap in the audience but it would at least have been a better comparison point vs. Lie To Me’s performance in the slot.
And is the bubble finally starting to burst on the CSI franchise?
Of all the new shows on ABC I hope that Better Off Ted is given a second season to try to grow an audience. I know that this will most likely not happen but this is the funniest show I have seen in a long time. Those Veridian Dynamics commercials are hysterical! I bet you it would be a hit if it was on NBC right after the Office. Better Off Ted is exactly what ABC needs if they want to compete with NBCs single camera comedies. Ultimately ABC just can’t seem to get the ball rolling with any comedy if it doesn’t air right after Dancing With the Stars so who knows what may happen. My advise to ABC, if you want to have a comedy block you need to pick a time slot and stick to it. Stop shifting them all over the schedule and give them time to grow, it’s not going to happen overnight!
KHL, it is indeed rare for a show to get 18-34 numbers close (or bigger) than it’s 18-49 numbers. It is also very vey impressive.
Wow. Nothing after Lost ends up working on ABC. The last season of Lost on ABC may be a blessing for them. I know they love the show, the DVD sales, the online content hits but because of the type of show it is and the audience that watches it, it can’t help launch a new show.
With that being said I think ABC needs to try to let some shows stick around for next season. The Unusuals isn’t a show that will carry ABC to many victories but it is a somewhat solid show with a good cast and a storyline that’s easy to follow. I think some shows need to be given patience so they can hit their strides creatively. There are many shows I loved that took a good season or so till it hit it’s creative high. I think we, the viewing public, might be missing out on some good quality tv due to the itchy trigger finger of the networks. I understand why they do it but as a viewer it’s disapointing.
I’m also confused as to the scheduling of a glorified recap show next week for Lost. What’s the point? If they were going to air 17 hours why didn’t they start the season later to allow for the show to be shown back to back as they have done before (with much fan approval)? It is nothing but a momentum killer for any good episode the week before.
I agree with Tommy, I would like to see Better Off Ted given a second season, mainly because its getting much better every week and I think with some decent marketing it could become a regular performer. On a side note, does anyone else think that ABC’s marketing team all needs to be fired? Not only are all of the previews NOT in HD, they look terrible, the sound is awful, and they tack on “ABC’s” to everything like they own the world.
Lost ratings- meh, dont care. The show is signed to finish, and as long as I get to keep watching, I will not fret over the numbers.
I’ve noticed that CSI NY’s demos have dropped in the last weeks. Could this show be in trouble?
The only show that worked after Lost was…..The Bachelor.
KHL its not the norm for shows to pull a higher 18-34 than 18-49, usually the 18-49 is higher and there are only a handful of shows on network television at least that buck that trend. I don’t know off the top of my head whether Lost is usually one of them but I suspect its at the very least it doesn’t usually drop much in the 18-34 vs. 18-49.
I’m pretty sure CSINY was a repeat this week, at least thats what is being said on other sites, and my DVR didn’t record it as a new episode.
Alex, I don’t think the CSI bubble will burst for a couple more seasons yet. They have held up better than i thought they would. 2.8 for NY is a series low. That is still very decent, and this is the weakest of the bunch.
CSI:NY was NEW, it was the only new episode last night on CBS.
I do agree with you Bob, ABC’s marketing is pretty sad. But the head of programming is right up there with them. They haven’t had a hit show in years and they don’t really have much time before Grey’s Anatomy and Desperate Housewives end their runs. And since lost is already contracted to finish it’s run I could care less how low the ratings go, I know I have it till it’s over!
I had accepted that Better Off Ted wouldn’t be around next season and I should enjoy it while it lasted, but after Robert put it in the “maybe” column the other day and the fact that last night was their funniest episode yet, I’m not quite ready to let go.
CSI NY is awful and should be cancelled. At least CSI: Miami is crazy entertaining.
As things stand with ABC I’d like to see them bring Castle back over anything else they’ve debuted this year but won’t be holding my breath on that because the numbers are bad. But out of everything they’ve debuted this year Castle seems to be their best shot at growing something over the long term but even then that seems like a long shot at this point.
On another note how are the new ABC shows doing vs. Eli Stone, Dirty Sexy Money and Boston Legal in particular? I’m wondering if perhaps ABC is going to end up kicking themselves for axing all three of those.
CSI: NY was originally supposed to be a repeat. They changed it Friday (?), but didn’t send out a new press release (it was changed in the press release with all the odd scheduling stuff). That means no preview aired after last week’s episode and all the printed guides (as well as many electronic guides) had it as a repeat.
i dont know why FOX decided to air Bones instead of Lie to Me. They continue to mess with LtM’s schedule. it makes no sense to me. Don’t get me wrong, I love bones but you dont keep messing up a show’s schedule and think it’ll hold its audience.
The problem for ABC is they don’t know how to market their new shows. I have like most of their new shows over the past few years. They were are really creative, and entertaining in their own ways. ABC needs to think outside the box and start a real marketing campaign or nothing is going to work for them. Network TV as a whole is struggling, so you have to go above and beyond to get an audience.
Alex, they won’t kick themselves for axing those shows. Boston Legal has the best shot at making such a claim, but the relationship with ABC and DEK seemed to go sour very quickly so I doubt ABC is kicking themselves over that either. Now if the new DEK show winds up doing strong for NBC next year, that might have ABC kick itself a bit.
I know some people are of the mind that Castle will be kept because ABC won’t cancel EVERY new one hour drama, but I think ABC will play the “blah blah, blah strike, blah, blah, blah development season screwed up, blah, blah, next year will be better” card, and cancel them all. We’ll see.
CSI:NY was schedule to be a rerun this week until late last week, when they made changes to air the episode previously schedule to air this week and next week it’s a new Criminal Minds in CSINY times slot. They release a bunch of schedule changes late last week that cause confusion.
They have several Bones episodes to burn due to the countless preemptions due to Obama. Bones will also be airing this Monday instead of a House rerun.
I actually found the ABC marketing good, the NBC marketing is also vert good, for me CBS has the worst marketing and promos.
LOST is once again the number one scripted show in all the demos. 18-34 a 4.0, blew everyone else out. Very impressive.
128 I agree that the CSI franchise isn’t likely going anywhere anytime soon but a series low for New York last night given the circumstances (a Law & Order repeat and The Unusuals) seems incredibly odd. Couple that with the worrying recent numbers of CSI itself on Thursday nights and eyebrows can be raised. Maybe it’s just a blip but its worth mentioning that an original episode of New York only just beat a repeating Criminal Minds, which was against Idol and new Lost. And it only just beat the repeating NCIS and Mentalist, which were up against Idol, Biggest Loser and Dancing With The Stars on Tuesday Night. It’s a head scratcher.
I hope next season, we actually get a completely uninterrupted season of Lost. If that means having to wait one more week and only starting the season with one episode instead of two, I can deal with it. However, I think they will have a major clip show the week before the series finale.
Cool the on network marketing might be ok, but if no one is watching your network when you run your ad is it doing any good? They need to start buying some ad space on cable in the early evening during the higher rated syndicated shows, and sporting events. A few magazine ads couldn’t hurt either.
I agree Robert. The strike season will be a good excuse if they can everything. Although I wouldn’t be surprised to see Castle come back for 13 episodes. Although i’d rather see The Unusuals be given an extra order because I think it has more potential.
ABC has to be hoping that the pilot order for next season has that magic that it did in 2004 with Lost and Desperate Housewives. Something needs to stick at ABC this next season. I can’t say anything I read about sounds like a game changer though.
Holly, but last time CSI NY had a new episode, the demos and ratings were lower than previous weeks.
Since next season is the last for Lost, maybe ABC should air it in the fall so it won’t be up against American Idol.
Castle is certainly the only drama that has a chance, but not if it continues with sub-2 numbers. It HAS to go back up and stay there for the rest of it’s run. No dipping in and out of the 2.x zone.
Robert I agree that ABC can (and likely will) cancel everything this season and just chalk it up to the strike, my general hypothesis was that if they’re going to take a gamble on any of their shows growing next year I’d go with Castle just because on paper it seems the most growth friendly. Realistically though I expect it to be gone along with everything else ABC debuted this year.
As far as kicking themselves for their rush of cancellations let me rephrase slightly – with hindsight are they maybe going to be wishing they’d let Eli Stone and DSM take a full second season before dropping the axe given how badly their midseason replacements are now performing. I don’t think any of the shows were likely going to survive for a third season but in terms of the network averages there’s got to be some sense of, that didn’t work out like we’d hoped. Hindsight being 20/20 and all that.
LOL at Castle being growth friendly, Alex! Growth friendly shows have a trend where they start at a 1.9 and grow towards a 3.0, Castle has a trend that is the opposite of that. I worry that your enjoyment of the show is clouding your (normally good) judgment! It would be like me making a case for renewal for LIFE (I enjoy it a lot!), but sadly, there just is no case to be made.
EDIT – Or am I over estimating the numbers Stone and DSM were actually pulling? My memory = the suck.
Last week CSI:NY had a 3.3. Earlier in the season it had a 2.9 and several in lower 3s. It still winning the timeslot and we are talking about a ten pm show on Wednesday night. All I was saying and I can’t speak for Holly but I took it as her explaning that last night there was confusion as to whether CSINY was new or rerun.
Never thought I’d say this, being a big Christina Applegate fan, but if I had to choose between Samantha Who? and Better off Ted, I’d have to axe Samantha Who?. Better off Ted is really finding its footing now, but I’m afraid ABC won’t give it a shot.
Hell, their whole Wednesday night is messed up. No way in hell is it a good sign when a L&O repeat almost ties your new show, even with Lost protecting it.
Wednesday nights might shape up to be next year’s battleground night. Well, for 2nd place after Idol, anyway.
hey did u guys post the DVR numbers for TSCC? i cant find them if you did.
Alex, I agree it’s interesting. Is it supposed to be new next week? Maybe we’ll see if this apparent last minute schedule change had anything to do with it.
If I was CBS I would be moast worried about the aforementioned CSI mothership on Thursdays. Without checking the historical numbers, I think it has shed a higher % of demo since the season started. It need to regain it’s pre-200th-episode numbers tonight or CBS will be disappointed.
i dont think ABC will cancel everything but definitely the Unusuals. Thats just too low for a 1 hour drama. i really hope they renew better off ted and surviving suburbia. i love them!!!!!!!
Hey Cool-
That’s great that you like ABC’s and NBC’s commercials, but that doesn’t mean anyone is watching them.
Criminal Minds getting more viewers on a repeat instead of Lost is pretty impressive and has got to say something about CBS.
I don’t understand putting a repeat of 90210 on after America’s Next Top Model. They should put original episodes of The Game on after and I guarantee that the ratings would increase dramatically. Seems like a no-brainer, but if the CW’s goal was to see the show fail anyway, then I know why it has not happened yet.
Jack, no. we didn’t see the DVR data this week (which would have been for a few weeks ago) yet.
Robert let me elaborate on my Castle looks like the most growth friendly show – I’m talking purely in terms of the show itself in regards to the premise and structure its pretty much the only new drama on ABC that an audience can just drop right into off the bat and isn’t horrifically bad. I’m not kidding myself in that its actually shown signs of growth but like I said if ABC is going to take a gamble on any of their new shows next year Castle seems like the most obvious choice as a show that can potentially grow an audience. Whether it actually could is another matter entirely and so far everything says that it won’t.
So Cal, you should watch the demos for both shows
@the128boy, next week CSINY doesn’t air. Instead they air repeat of CM at their usual spot then a new one at 10 pm, CSINY spot. All part of last week schedule changes.
Mar, thanks for the info. Interesting to see what kind of numbers it will get there with itself as a lead in.
Alex, and now I think your judgment has definitely been compromised by your enjoyment of the show.
That seems like a HUGE reach, based on the last 2 or 3 weeks of data. If a Chuck fan made some similar claims you would rip into them. The numbers don’t justify anything other than cancellation for ABC. Chuck’s case on NBC is stronger than any case for Castle on ABC at this point. Nobody ever said life was fair.
BTW, you do overestimate in the cases of Eli Stone, Dirty Sexy Money and Pushing Daisies. Not so much in the case of Boston Legal, though BL’s s-t-d average was lower than Life On Mars’.
A betting man would agree with Robt Seidman that all of ABC’s new shows are toast, precisely because only retards ARE buying the strike excuse when it clearly is not the reason for this year’s abject failures. Again I say, five hours of Barbara Walters/20/20 style infotainment crap ala Leno on NBC might save ABC $$$. Some of you may hate Zucker but he’s a realist behind the press conference BS. ABC shot its bolt. Nice try. You have two scripted hits and a cult classic ( Lost) which is syndication and maybe overseas gold. I’d tell ABC also to get creative with the ( yuk ) reality shows. How about 18 year old bachelorette spinoffs, or even 8 year old overweight bachelorettes with before/after rhinoplasty, face transplants etc? We all know South Park was right, that Mouseketeer bachelorettes are your bread and butter and have been since the 1990’s. Why wimp out now?
Lourdes, My point was that because of the scheduling changes and resulting confusion last night’s low numbers for CSI: NY are more likely an anomaly and not indicative of a trend.
Why doesn’t Abc move LOST to 8.00pm?
Robert Seidman says:
April 16th, 2009 at 10:24 am
Alex, and now I think your judgment has definitely been compromised by your enjoyment of the show. That seems like a HUGE reach, based on the last 2 or 3 weeks of data. If a Chuck fan made some similar claims you would rip into them. The numbers don’t justify anything other than cancellation for ABC. Chuck’s case on NBC is stronger than any case for Castle on ABC at this point. Nobody ever said life was fair.
As Austin Powers would say, “Ouch, baby. Very ouch.” To be fair, though. I did like Eli Stone. Jonny Lee Miller is very underrated as an actor. And although I considered Pushing Daisies to be quirky and fun, that’s like doing a one-hour sprint: you’re dead-tired when they’re finished. Talented cast, though, no question.
Oh, I forgot “Unusuals” was on last night. This is what happens when networks keep trying out new shows over and over and over. I would have watched it if I had remembered. Watched “CSI NY” instead.
BOT deserves some love. its improving in ratings which is sumthing abc’s other new shows aren’t doing. if abc has any ounce of smarts they’d give it a try. it’ll never be huge in the ratings department becuz of the type of show it is but it can grow. i honestly don’t understand what abc would expect from a show like bot i mean anybody could see it’ll likely never be a ratings success its a niche type of show. i wish it could be behind the office. ooo abc plz keep it around i’m really liking it
LOSTs ratings at this point dont matter since its ending next year – though ABC will miss its strong demos. LOST has been a little slow paced lately, they need to pick things up. Maybe The Observer from FRINGE could make a guest appearance on LOST where Locke spots him standing on a hill and says “Who the hell is that?” and Ben says “I have no idea, ask the Smoke Monster”. They are on different networks, but it would be funny.
I see a short life for the UNUSUALS.
Again Robert my point is completely unrelated to the numbers I’m not kidding myself that its actually shown signs of growth because it really hasn‘t and I fully expect it to get canned. My point was that if (and I don’t think they will) ABC opted to gamble on one of their new dramas being able to grow an audience next year on paper (in terms of its structure and set up) Castle seems like the most obvious option. Its not got any real serialised elements unlike The Unusuals and its just generally not Cupid, which will work in every shows favour for the rest of time.
Looking at the numbers Castle and all the other new ABC shows are gone but if I’m ABC and I gamble on anything turning things around next year its Castle purely because an audience can drop into it half way through its run and not have to catch up on any serialised elements or overcome the fact that its Cupid.
It’s a moot point though because I don’t ABC is going to gamble on any of this years new shows for next season. None of them are good or stable enough (at the right numbers) to warrant the gamble. They’ll ditch them chalk it up to the strike and hope something hits next year.
Lost still does good even though its on the same time as American Idol. Thats why ABC probably it there.
“The repeat of SVU outperformed last week’s season (and likely series) finale of Life.”
Both Criminal Minds and SVU were reruns that appealed to the same audience. Criminal Minds was new last week against Life. SVU is NBC’s top show and it performs poorly in the Wednesday 9pm timeslot. Here’s what Life gets when it doen’t split this audience (or airs on Friday).
http://tvbythenumbers.com/2008/12/04/wednesday-red-nosed-reindeer-and-victorias-secret-models-lead-cbs-to-demo-wins/9183
Surely, NBC execs (who should be wearing paper bags over their heads after this season) know that a poor place for a crime drama to build an audience is against another high rated crime drama that has stayed in the Wednesday 9pm time slot for 4 years and was promoted after Super Bowl XLI. Viewers are stubborn about what they watch.
NBC has had several shows start poorly over its history. Cheers, Family Ties, Hill Street Blues and St. Elsewhere started weak. Seinfeld was a mid-ranked sitcom – Wednesdays at 9pm versus Home Improvement. (Didn’t Seinfeld almost take the show to FOX?) Another observation of this is NBC was in ratings trouble when it gave these shows a chance. How’s NBC doing today?
With the neck-deep ratings trouble NBC is in, what programs do they have that have earned renewal? SVU and what? This is why some of their shows will come back despite these numbers. Hopefully, Life will be one of them with its AFI recognition. Besides being a favorite, that’s why I think Life will survive.
Take another look at last week’s ratings, Life only got a 4.5 but it held steady between 2 reruns. I think its got a cult following.
i just saw that the CBS sitcoms are repeats again next week so maybe Scrubs and Better Off Ted will do even more better next week hopefully, even if Better Off Ted goes up to a 2.0 rating!
Alex, you are talking about gambling with a show that got a 2.0 on Monday at 10pm. And Castle is on ABC who has much better ratings, than say, NBC. You wouldn’t gamble on Chuck’s 2.3 (which for NBC, wasn’t bad — and actually did represent week over week growth!) but you would gamble on a show that had a 2.0 (and in the string of 3.0/8 > 2.9/8 > 2.5/7 > 2.4/6 > 2.3/6 > 2.0/5!) at 10pm on a network with much better overall ratings. Please excuse me for thinking that sounds like CRAZY TALK
But it does, sorry.
http://tvbythenumbers.com/2008/12/09/top-nbc-primetime-shows-december-1-7-2008/9380
Here’s another link I meant to include. Life topped many NBC shows this week when not against Criminal Minds. Or Lost. Or American Idol.
MAJC, Life’s cult following is about a demo point shy of being renewal worthy.
Castle needs to rebound to 2.3 or 2.4 territory and stay there, or it’s toast.
MAJC, Life’s cult following is about a demo point shy of being renewal worthy.
Sadly, I have to agree.
kellie, I have never seen Better Off Ted, but I have been saying since it’s premiere night that no one should count it out yet. Robert has it in the “maybe” column in his analysis.
The Pros:
Good retention out of Scrubs.
High 18-34 numbers.
The Cons:
Bad 18-49 numbers overall. REALLY bad some weeks.
Also, giving it props for pulling a 1.9 isn’t really logical, because of what the competition was. Half of the shows it went up against were repeats (including the opposing comedy block) and the only other original programming in that hour was Top Model and Bones. Hardly a cutthroat hour.
While I know they won’t do it and people might think I’m crazy, but this is what I say ABC should do in the fall.
Sunday
7:00 AFV
8:00 EM: Home Edition
9:00 Desperate Housewives
10:00 New Series
It’s time to launch a new show after DH and give B&S the opportunity to shine on its own.
Monday
8:00 DWTS (yes, do more hour long shows!!!!!)
9:00 Surviving Suburbia
9:30 Better Off Ted
10:00 New Series
I know they won’t do this, but this would give Ted a real chance.
Tuesday
8:00 DWTS Results
9:00 Brothers & Sisters
10:00 New Series
More likely, they’ll air DWTS at 9 and B&S at 10, but I think they should try this method out personally.
Wednesday
8:00 Castle
9:00 The Unusuals or Cupid (whichever has a better demo by seasons end)
10:00 Primtime: What Would You Do?
I say they should give these two shows an opportunity in the 8 and 9pm hours to see what they can do!
Thursday
8:00 Ugly Betty
9:00 Grey’s Anatomy
10:00 Private Practice
This one’s a no-brainer, even if Betty is losing steam. How about they put Betty to rest early so they can air Lost at 8pm.
Friday
8:00 Wife Swap
9:00 Supernanny
10:00 20/20
Saturday
8:00 College Football
“Not Sure Yet” is not the same as “Maybe”. I think Better Off Ted will likely be canceled, but I don’t feel as surely about that as I do some other shows
JT, I think it’s fair to say Cupid and Unusuals are deader than dead at this point.
Castle is the only show that has a chance to redeem itself, and it’s not all that likely (but still technically possible).
ABC schedulers are dumbass’s why put a cop show in a time slot which only has other cop shows ?, why not a show which is geared towards the female demo: oddly enough really none of these shows have done much better (in fact generally worse) than Dirty Sexy Money (before ABC messed it around and killed it).
Personally although I think The Unusuals is doing badly (and theres no denying it) I think in comparison to its bad lead-in (LOST doesn’t seem to do a thing for a show after it now) and how bad everyone else is doing (all the new shows) I think the Unsuals has the same chance (if not a tiny bit better) than say Castle, Cupid, In The Motherhood, Samantha Who? (but then again I think all of those will be cancelled) – though Castle could rebound. The Unusuas needs to hold its ground .
Though I’d agree with Alex on ABC proberly sticking with Castle.
I’m sure Castle real test will come next Monday without an all new CSI:Miami, I’m sure the procedural junkies will look for one.
Robert, sorry for that misquote.
I forgot the terminology you used.
JT: I guess BBT, HIMYM, TaaHM and RoE high ratings doesn’t count in the world you live in so off with their head.
Robert not what I actually said but don’t let that stop you’re good time.
What I actually said was if ABC were going to gamble on any of their new shows for next season I’d expect them to go with Castle purely because the premise is casual viewer friendly and therefore represents the best potential for growth. I have however followed that several times with the point that I don’t think ABC will gamble on any of their new shows because they don’t have to and said on more than a couple of occasions that Castle’s numbers are horrible, I fully expect it to get canned and that whilst the set up of the show might allow for audience growth the show hasn’t actually shown any signs it can achieve it.
In the hypothetical ABC absolutely has to bring back one of their new dramas Castle tops the list right now but that’s a hypothetical I don’t think is going to become reality.
I’m not (unlike Chuck fans for example) advocating that the network take a gamble on it growing next year nor am I advocating that given the general lay of the land at ABC they should stick with Castle and see what happens. In fact I’m not advocating they should renew it at all. Like I said I fully expect it gone by the end of its run and to be honest I won’t mourn its loss either. It’s an OK show that’s gotten better during its run but I won’t miss it a tenth as much as I will Life for example.
Meanwhile I’ll also point out that the Chuck comparison is pretty poor because if you set up a similar hypothetical of NBC absolutely has to bring back one of Chuck, Law & Order or Medium for example Chuck would sit at the bottom of that list (Law & Order would be at the top for anyone interested) for various reasons that I won’t go into here. On the other hand if its NBC absolutely has to bring back one of Chuck, Life or Kings I’d give the nod to Chuck (despite loving Life). But again those are hypothetical’s that aren’t ever going to become reality so it’s a moot point.
I don’t think ABC has to or will gamble on any of their new shows but if they did I’d put money on Castle being the one they plump for. That’s what I’m saying.
^Oops, I got mixed up with CBS
Jauggernaut Hannah Montanna / Cyrus and Jauggernaut A.I = Jauggernaut ratings in the 18-49 …
On Monday Castle faces off against a repeat of a Mentalist episode instead of a CSI:Miami rerun along with a new episode of Medium.
Boy – I’m slow – CW beat CBS??? …now there’s a banner ad for the CW !
no offense JT but you’re schedule sucks.
Alex says:
April 16th, 2009 at 11:11 am
Meanwhile I’ll also point out that the Chuck comparison is pretty poor because if you set up a similar hypothetical of NBC absolutely has to bring back one of Chuck, Law & Order or Medium for example Chuck would sit at the bottom of that list (Law & Order would be at the top for anyone interested) for various reasons that I won’t go into here. On the other hand if its NBC absolutely has to bring back one of Chuck, Life or Kings I’d give the nod to Chuck (despite loving Life). But again those are hypothetical’s that aren’t ever going to become reality so it’s a moot point.
One problem: neither of Medium or Law & Order have been tried as a first-run show at 8PM. Repeats of L&O, sure. But look where that got NBC last night. The battle for surival isn’t between Medium, Law & Order, and Chuck, but between Medium vs. Law & Order, then Chuck vs. a new show. Medium’s advantage is that it can continue to premiere mid-season and still thrive. Law & Order is the stalwart, of course, and Chuck is the one you know can place at 8PM. The other two would be almost as big of a gamble as a new show. (Ask ABC how they feel about premiering shows.)
Given that over half of Leno’s viewers are above 54 (that, or under 25, I’m not sure which), it would make for a tough night of TV if you went old/young/old with your three shows. Of course, nobody can really know what the demos of a 10PM Leno show would actually be, but since over half of the current audience is outside of the coveted demographics, you have to tailor your schedule to match.
R.G., Top Model also regularly beats CBS wednesday sitcoms in it’s much-prized 18-34 category.
@ the128boy…
Hence why I’m s—-l—-o—-w!
Patrick Murphy, % of total viewership that is 18-49 doesn’t matter, because total viewership doesn’t matter.
All that matters IS the demo.
Now, you could argue that % of 18-49 that is 18-34 matters (because demo matters).
Does the CW’s Smallville or Supernatural qualify for cult status?
The CW renewed several series based on this. Expect NBC to do the same with shows like Life and Chuck.
MAJC, Do NOT expect NBC to renew Life or Chuck based on ‘cult status’.
Expect NBC to axe Life, and expect NBC to *possibly* renew Chuck for reasons OTHER THAN cult status.
i love lost but honestly what difference does it make if it does better in ratings one week than the next. it more or less has a consistent following every week and it already has an official end date. would abc really cut it if it dipped really badly this week..i mean come on no. plus the people at abc wud get shot so i think its numbers are kinda unimportant. one thing thats certain is that its apparently not a good lead in. people that watch lost, tune in to watch that alone they dont seem to give a crap about anything else.the unusuals is ok i’m not that into cop shows but it doesnt matter whether i watch it or not becuz i dont live in America so my viewership is worthless. have to give more love to bot again. come on survive
the128boy says:
April 16th, 2009 at 11:37 am
Patrick Murphy, % of total viewership that is 18-49 doesn’t matter, because total viewership doesn’t matter.
All that matters IS the demo.
Now, you could argue that % of 18-49 that is 18-34 matters (because demo matters).
Right, but you can’t change the audience that watches a particular show, you can only acknowledge it and organize your schedule that captures similar audiences so they’ll stay with your channel all night long. Or make sure you don’t put in shows that have the same demographic breakdown as a more popular show on another network. Either way, you want that 18-49 crowd (especially the 18-34’s), but if you stick a young show between two “older” shows, you may not get the young people to tune in to the young show; they’ll just go with another channel all night. (this of course doesn’t include fans who are hell-bent on seeing a particular show.)
The main point I was making with Alex was you can’t have a schedule of Law & Order/Chuck/Leno because you’d have a hard time getting the younger Chuck crowd to tune in to NBC for just the one hour. (this doesn’t even account for Chuck getting killed by Lost, which it likely would) More likely, they’ll just let it pass entirely. If you were making the schedule with those two shows (hypothetically, of course), you’d go Chuck/Law & Order/Leno. Of course, putting Chuck or Heroes with the original Law & Order is not a good idea in the first place. SVU maybe, but not the original.
NBC has limited options right now at 8PM with existing shows. They’d have to gamble on a new show, like ABC seems to be now.
Alex, that’s straw man-ish. Hypothetically speaking NBC can bring back ALL THREE of those shows — it wouldn’t surprise me much. Based on the numbers, ABC bringing back Castle would surprise me more.
Patrick Murphy, gotcha. I think i pretty much agree with that. And yes, flow is extremely important. But people can switch channels. I’m not sure that dropping a “young” show inbetween two “old” shows would be a death sentence. I think that more than the “old” or “young” factor would be show similarity.
Hahaa I cant help but to smile at ABC’S ”failure”. So good!
They cant get a hit show anymore. They have Lost on theirr hands and after it ends, its downhill completely for them.
Maybe what they’re doing wrong is NOT putting the shows on air by category. I mean a sci-fi show like Lost followed by a cop show? It seems wrong.
Robert I think you’re missing the general point I was making, which is that I would only advocate the renewal of Castle with a certain hypothetical situation just as I’d only advocate the renewal of Chuck under a certain hypothetical situation. I’m not (as you suggested) saying that ABC should in general gamble on Castle next year because it has potential to grow an audience.
On another note Patrick who suggested airing Law & Order/Chuck/Leno next year? You’re kind of pulling that from nowhere. I used Law & Order, Medium and Chuck as an example because Law & Order and Medium were literally the first two NBC bubble shows that I could think of off the top of my head. Beyond that if you’d read beyond the sentence that listed all three shows or the majority of my thoughts on Chuck vs. the rest of the NBC line-up you’d know that I don’t in anyway think the three shows are in competition with one another. It (like the Chuck vs. Life vs. Kings hypothetical that followed and the Cupid vs. Castle vs. Unusuals that went before it) was an examples of a hypothetical situation that I don’t think is going to happen.
If NBC axed L&O what would it run in place of all of the other shows that it will inevitably axe next season? They get so many miles out of L&O reruns. It would be kind of stupid if they did cancel it. How well does Medium rerun? What about Chuck? Seriously, I think it will be Dick Wolf who ultimately says that L&O is done, not NBC. Then again, this is NBC we’re talking about.
Alex says:
April 16th, 2009 at 12:15 pm On another note Patrick who suggested airing Law & Order/Chuck/Leno next year? You’re kind of pulling that from nowhere. I used Law & Order, Medium and Chuck as an example because Law & Order and Medium were literally the first two NBC bubble shows that I could think of off the top of my head. Beyond that if you’d read beyond the sentence that listed all three shows or the majority of my thoughts on Chuck vs. the rest of the NBC line-up you’d know that I don’t in anyway think the three shows are in competition with one another. It (like the Chuck vs. Life vs. Kings hypothetical that followed and the Cupid vs. Castle vs. Unusuals that went before it) was an examples of a hypothetical situation that I don’t think is going to happen.
Mine were hypotheticals as well. Obviously a Chuck/Law & Order pairing is crazy. But the hypothetical you set up for NBC vs. the hypothetical you set up for ABC doesn’t really work as well, since the ABC shows in question are in closer competition for similar timeslots and audiences. Not as much young vs. old there. A better comparison might have been Law and Order SVU/Medium/Southland. Now obviously SVU has already been renewed, but the three audiences run along closer lines.
I do agree with Robert, though. I think you can make room for all three shows somewhere, even if not September-May. It’s like NBC has a better shot of rebuilding its audience with a smaller team of veterans than ABC will of having to go through the “draft” with new shows. 5 less hours of programming gives you that advantage, I guess. Football comparisons, I know. But everybody at my workplace is already arguing next season’s games, and I’m the only Bears fan of the group. (the rest are Cowboys and Panters fans)
yay for bones, love those numbers. bones is so good for fox, fox are so bad to bones, it really annoys me.
But, Alex, it’s a silly hypothetical argument to make, since you yourself admit that it’s extremely unlikely.
But even if it were likely, I’m not sure I buy your argument that Castle has more growth potential than The Unusuals or Cupid. It has dropped much further than either of them, and has shown no signs of stopping yet. Cupid was actually up in the finals this week from last week! Castle has the higher average because it’s the only one that actually started out at a decent level, but I don’t think that, even in your hypothetical situation, there’s really any more of an argument for Castle than for Cupid or even The Unusuals.
the128boy says:
April 16th, 2009 at 11:56 am
Patrick Murphy, gotcha. I think i pretty much agree with that. And yes, flow is extremely important. But people can switch channels. I’m not sure that dropping a “young” show inbetween two “old” shows would be a death sentence. I think that more than the “old” or “young” factor would be show similarity.
Yeah, I’m probably not giving people enough credit there. Maybe I’m thinking too rigidly about programming, like placing comedies first/dramas last in an evening. Still, I can’t envision a situation where Chuck would work better as a 9PM show instead of an 8PM show. Unless it followed two sitcoms, but that’s not likely to happen, especially given the comedy pilots NBC green-lit. They’re scary.
this is why Bones should be on Wednesdays instead of Thursdays!!!!
I’m surprised Bones did that well and that everyone knew it was on.
Julia I agree but I didn’t make the hypothetical I was responding to someone else with the point that if ABC has to gamble on a new show next year I think it’ll be Castle, which then rolled into Robert trying to paint the picture that I was arguing they should gamble on it regardless, hence the reason we’re still going around in circles on this point.
In general though Julia my point on Castle is and was that it has more drop in potential than The Unusuals, which is building a serialised story arc and has more all around quality than Cupid therefore if you’re gambling on any of them and they’re all at about the same level numbers wise (and right now they pretty much are) you go with the one that’s not a complete train wreck and is more casual viewer friendly. It was less about their numbers (because all three have horrible numbers) and all about the general content of the shows.
And Patrick as I said to Robert it was less that the hypothetical’s were realistic or particularly worthwhile but more that they were there to demonstrate a basic point – under unlikely circumstance x I can see show y being renewed.
Actually, I wasn’t even paying attention to my own posts, because I didn’t advocate a Chuck/Law & Order/Leno night. I was pointing out the old/young/old issue with shows and used Law and Order (old demographics) and Chuck (younger demographics) as examples of not to put an “old” show followed by a “young” show, because you have to assume at this point that Leno’s demographics will skew old like they do now.
As for ABC, I’m stumped as well as to what should happen with their shows. Nothing they seem to put on the air as midseason replacements have done any better (and typically do worse) than the shows that got axed to begin with.
Alex, Chuck has a better shot at renewal than Castle. That’s not hypothetical.
I agree that the notion of Castle has more promise than the notion of the Unusuals, the premieres for each definitely support the thinking. But notions sometimes get dashed in a hurry. At this point, there doesn’t seem to be any promise for either.
Alex says:
April 16th, 2009 at 12:41 pm And Patrick as I said to Robert it was less that the hypothetical’s were realistic or particularly worthwhile but more that they were there to demonstrate a basic point – under unlikely circumstance x I can see show y being renewed.
True that. I also agree that ABC is likely kicking itself right now for some of the shows they let go.
Wow, that Leno move doesn’t seem so stupid these days, does it. Guaranteed revenue 5 hours each week, unless Leno is a complete idiot in developing his new show. Even then, it still won’t be a Kings-sized disaster. $4.3M per episode. Yikes!
As for ABC, I’m stumped as well as to what should happen with their shows. Nothing they seem to put on the air as midseason replacements have done any better (and typically do worse) than the shows that got axed to begin with.
They should and will dump every midseason show with the possible exception of Surviving Suburbia, but even that I’m not so sure about. This season will be written off as a casualty of the strike, due to the piss-poor pilot season they had because of it.
Robert I don’t disagree that Chuck stands a much better chance of renewal than Castle but that doesn’t change the fact I’m never going to advocate a Chuck renewal because I think NBC (like ABC as it happens) has to cut their loses at this point and debut a new slate of shows next year. For whatever reason audience aren’t in general connecting with the NBC line-up as a whole so the solution to that is to change the NBC line-up to something else and see what happens.
You stick with the shows that work and for NBC that’s pretty much The Office, 30 Rock, SVU and Biggest Loser and build around those.
Julia says:
April 16th, 2009 at 12:54 pm They should and will dump every midseason show with the possible exception of Surviving Suburbia, but even that I’m not so sure about. This season will be written off as a casualty of the strike, due to the piss-poor pilot season they had because of it.
But the strike is now a year and change in the rear-view mirror. Not every network is suffering like they are (other than NBC, natch). Not to mention, that still wouldn’t explain shows that are tanking they did bring back (like Samantha Who?), or shows they knew they would place midseason anyway (like Scrubs). CBS and Fox had the same strike to contend with, and neither of them are really any worse for the wear. Lie to Me and The Mentalist are two examples of rookie shows that are thriving.
I’m not sure it’s good to dump EVERY midseason show. Otherwise, you’re starting ‘09-’10 the exact same way you started ‘08-’09. The key will be packaging the right shows and picking some decent pilots.
Alex, I am standing by my theory that your judgment has been clouded by your enjoyment of Castle. To bring up a hypothetical doesn’t make any sense. If you believe NBC should go with what works and are so steadfast in maintaining that (and whether I agree with the letter of that argument, I do agree with the spirit of it), even bringing up a hypothetical where ABC would renew a show that performed worse than Chuck seems absurd.
Patrick, yes, the strike is a year in the rear view mirror, but its impact on the development season for THIS season is still with us. I’m with Julia down the line that ABC will write it all off to that. whether it is actually true or not doesn’t really matter! But since we can’t really prove that it isn’t true, all we can do is see how it goes for ABC next year. If it goes as badly we can then say “you can’t blame that on the strike!”
I miss LIFE already.
Alex says:
April 16th, 2009 at 1:05 pm
Robert I don’t disagree that Chuck stands a much better chance of renewal than Castle but that doesn’t change the fact I’m never going to advocate a Chuck renewal because I think NBC (like ABC as it happens) has to cut their loses at this point and debut a new slate of shows next year. For whatever reason audience aren’t in general connecting with the NBC line-up as a whole so the solution to that is to change the NBC line-up to something else and see what happens.
By why advocate that for NBC when ABC is in similar trouble? Grey’s Anatomy is its only scripted juggernaut show shown during the weeknights. (NBC counterprograms on Sundays vs. Desperate Housewives with football, so that’s a wash) Private Practice loses 33% of it’s Grey’s lead-in, and Ugly Betty has been on the bubble for ABC, although I can’t imagine them canceling it this season. With those 5 extra hours of programming to do that NBC doesn’t have to do, that puts them into quite the predicament. ABC can’t get away with a slew of rookie shows any more than NBC can.
Robert Seidman says:
April 16th, 2009 at 1:15 pm
Patrick, yes, the strike is a year in the rear view mirror, but its impact on the development season for THIS season is still with us. I’m with Julia down the line that ABC will write it all off to that. whether it is actually true or not doesn’t really matter! But since we can’t really prove that it isn’t true, all we can do is see how it goes for ABC next year. If it goes as badly we can then say “you can’t blame that on the strike!”
Well, it just seems like other networks weren’t as badly affected, like Fox and CBS. Or to put it more accurately, I guess I have to question what state each of the respective networks was in before the strike started, since we seem to have far different results among them. At least in terms of shows succeeding vs. shows failing. Going by the R/I index from April 7th, ABC and Fox have similar 18-49 averages, yet there is much more turmoil at ABC.
The problem with development slates is that the margin of difference can be very small when it comes to judging success. FOX has two successes (how modest the success seems to be a function of how much the success is tied to American Idol in the mind of the person looking at the data). CBS has one definite success (The Mentalist) and one modest success (Eleventh Hour, which I think will be canceled anyway). It’s not like CBS and FOX launched 5 hit shows each this year, but 2 successes is more than none.
Following up something Tommy said, if ABC wants to have a successful comedy block, my advice to them? Go learn about counterprogramming. Seriously, they put on 3 1/2 hours’ worth of sitcoms this spring — most of them opposite comedy blocks on CBS or NBC. (The one hour that isn’t is of course cannon fodder burn-off for “American Idol.”) CBS and NBC don’t have that many comedy blocks. I’m sure it’s not that hard to find an hour where there isn’t one. Granted, they’re not nearly as sad as NBC with regards to counterprogramming. NBC brings back “Dateline” midseason. Where are the two places they put it? Opposite “60 Minutes” and “20/20.”
Say what you will about FOX. At least they figured out the 3 best time slots to put their 3 procedurals. The 3 time slots where CBS isn’t airing procedurals.
Glad to see bones do so well!!! i for one hate the fact that it’s been anchoring the fox thursday, 8pm on thursday is a really tough one for me, i literally would like to watch all the shows on all the networks (top of my head: earl, smallville, survivor, ugly betty, bones…that’s a mean choice for one to have to make) out of all of those the highest priority is bones (for me at least)
as for lost, as much as i know the 10pm slot can be tough that is really where lost does best…it’s a show that really needs digesting and to be talked about afterwards (our group of six spends the next 30-45 min discussing what we’ve learned) even if we wanted to watch the unusuals (which we don’t) we wouldn’t/couldn’t because of this…
Castle is the best new show on television, I think the problem recently is that surviving suburbia is bringing down the numbers — also I think it will rebound because everything on abc was in repeat mode last week — with Greys PP, DH and Brothers all new — promos for castle will be more prominent. Remember that still October Road did worse in this time slot that castle has.
SOOOOO happy that the judges used their save to save the great matt giraud. Making it one of the best moments in idol history in my mind. He deserves to be in the top 3 not the bottom. Did you all see how happy Adam was that he was saved — and did you hear for the first time — everyone including his fellow singers were chanting save! I hope that you will all save a vote for him next week — he is a great singer
Is Idol ever going to move back to 8pm? Or will Lost be getting squashed like this every week from now on (except for when Idol ends)?
I’m so happy for Bones! and I’m also happy because there’s another episode airing today
..
Wow, bones did really well!
Hmmm… did the CW really beated CBS? waht a freakin shame!
I like how now ABC is advertising The Unusuals as gritty and dark when their attempts to sell it as goofy didn’t work. Sorry, ABC, your ads already convinced me that the show is cheesy and not funny. It’s too late to make the show seem cool.
Id say the numbers for Lost were pretty good considering the Idol competition. Then again I don’t really care what ratings Lost gets because I know that it will get its 6th season next year and then be done! I wish I could watch all the other shows I love with the knowledge of when they are or aren’t going to end. Since knowing the end date of Lost it has been an absolutely brilliant ride of television.
No matter how many times people say that Bones is underrated it isn’t doing what that show has done for FOX in its 4 seasons justice! Since 2005 it has aired on four different nights of the week and switched timeslots 7 times and somehow the ratings continue to climb every season.
Imagine what kind of audience Bones would attract if it was on CBS and stayed in a set time slot for a little while.
We’re all being hypotheticalized to a hypothetically torturous degree. Promos for Castle on Desperate Housewives ( if it is or is not a rerun? ) will save Castle if Surviving Suburbia loses .2 points off the 18-35 demo and it is raining in Chicago and a 3.0 to 4.0 earthquake hits the San Fernando Valley …
Hey Jimmy McDooshbag…no offense but I couldn’t give a rats ass what you think about my proposed lineup for abc.
Fox is lucky to have a show like “Bones”. I’m sure it’ll be back on wednesdays come fall…probably paired with LTM.
Robert firstly NBC and ABC are in different positions – Leno is very much the difference maker for NBC and puts them in a position where they can ditch everything that’s not working and move forward with only their strongest shows. Without Leno at 10 there’s no way we’re discussing Chuck being axed or Medium or Law & Order. With Leno at 10 NBC has the chance to completely change and refresh their line-up. For better or worse ABC don’t have that.
I think its incredibly unlikely to say the least that there’s any serious consideration to bringing Castle back as things stand. However I find the various hypothetical scenarios surrounding a Castle renewal easier to consider because its on ABC and unlike NBC they’re going to have to plug holes in the schedule next year. Their slate of locks going forward next year isn’t much improved on NBC’s and at least one of their locks is entirely dependent on its lead-in at this stage and worse still their show launching ratio is arguably worse than NBC’s right now.
As it stands I think ABC will ditch all of their new shows (with the exception being that Surviving Suburbia might survive if it manages to hold steady next week) however I think something like Castle or even The Unusuals has to do a lot less to make itself renewal worthy than Chuck does. If by some miracle either of Castle or The Unusuals rebounds to a 2.1 or 2.2 before the end of their respective runs then I think ABC does consider bringing it back – purely because they’ll likely need something and want a ‘new’ show to carry forward to a second season. To me its much more conceivable that Castle or The Unusuals can rebound three tenths than Chuck rebounding basically an entire point (although after this weeks number it is slightly less than that), which is where I think it would need to be to lock in renewal. For met at least.
Basically right now its much easier for me to entertain the hypothetical for ABC than it is for NBC because their situations are different and the threshold for what a show should need going forward is different. I’ll also point out that I brought up Castle as the ABC show of choice in response to someone else questioning ABC needing to bring something back next year.
And Patrick I’m not entirely sure what you’re asking me when you ask ‘why advocate that for NBC when ABC in in similar trouble’. I get the impression that you think I’m advocating a Castle renewal and lets be completely clear on this now – I’m not. What I am saying is that ABC is in a different position to NBC right now. Without Leno then I’d have no real issues with NBC renewing Chuck and I don’t think we’d even be discussing them not renewing it.
I’d love to see ABC ditch everything on their line-up that isn’t working but realistically I don’t think we can expect to see that happen because without a Leno like deal to explain it advertisers would have an unholy freak out if you axe everything but Dancing/The Bachelor, Greys, Private Practice (as long as it stays behind Greys) and Desperate Housewives. Like I said above if by some miracle Castle or The Unusuals rebounds slightly then ABC probably take another look at it.
Alex, it’s absurd. Your denial of the absurdity only makes me think it more absurd. You can write 500 paragraphs. Your argument is still absurd.
And for the record let me say again that I’m not advocating a Castle renewal.
Robert there’s no argument I’m not making a case for a Castle renewal which you for some reason think I am.
My point is I find it easier to see a scenario for a Castle renewal than a Chuck renewal because one’s on ABC and the other is on NBC. I don’t however expect Castle to come back.
I think CSI NY definitely suffered from the rerun confusion. It was originally supposed to be a rerun so they didn’t run a promo last week, then they changed it to a new episode. But a lot of the tv websites and dvr menus still said it was a repeat. And if you didn’t watch the rerun of CM, well then you might not have known that CSI NY was new.
My point is I find it easier to see a scenario for a Castle renewal than a Chuck renewal because one’s on ABC and the other is on NBC.
Your basis is that you feel like NBC has SO many losses it must cut them all, and that ABC doesn’t have as many bad shows so it doesn’t have to cut all of them. But nonetheless, because you LIKE the show, you concoct an absurd hypothetical (for a show that pulled a 1.9 rating in the final numbers! ONE POINT NINE. HELLO!? ).
So you would, hypothetically find keeping a show that generates a 1.9, on ABC easier than keeping a show that pulled a 2.3 the same night, albeit in different time slots.
sorry, still completely absurd.
The strike comments don’t wash, sorry. ABC only put on 2 new shows in the fall. Because of the strike. (They’ve both since been cancelled.) The bulk of the midseason pilots were produced and picked up well outside of pilot season. Delayed as a result of the strike. With the exceptions of “In the Motherhood” (an abortion of an amusing web series) and “Surviving Suburbia” (no explanation needed), their midseason freshmen aren’t completely worthless. They might not be great shows outside of “Ted,” but they’re not worthless. Believe me, ABC has put on completely worthless shows in the past. Before the strike. Heck, they even renewed a few of them for second seasons. “What About Brian” and “October Road” come to mind. Nobody can sit here with a straight face and tell me “Castle” and “Cupid” are creatively worse than those shows.
I kinda agree with Alex seeing as no new shows work for ABC I think they need to nurture shows like Castle: its a prodecural (spelling right?) so I think ABC could try and build an new audience seeing as its current one has gone. Plus Pushing Daisies went from a 4.3 to a 2.4 and it was still renewed (in a better TV Season, albeit it had no lead-in). Whether ABC likes it or not new shows are not working with shrinking broadcast veiwing(plus their new shows go all down hill), so they need to stick to shows that may build (like Castle). Aren’t networks are more likely to loose more from new shows (with low advertising costs and high risk of failure with most new shows failing) than renewing a weaker show. Granted though Castle still has to bounce back; though The Unusuals could do better seeing as its LOST lead-in is crap but thats a different matter.
I don’t understand at all why Castle & The Unusuals are dong well on ABC. Both are good shows & better then some other scripted shows on other networks. Both shows were adverstised really well. Does anyone have a theory? Both shows are pretty good, right? It is the other shows are Cable bringing the ratings down?
I like JT idea of moving Castle to 8pm on Wedensdays next Fall.
Oh-Well….still crossing my fingers for Chuck.
Wonder if Castle is to become the new Chuck? 141 Comments
Actually i’d proberly say if any show ABC will stick with Better Off Ted at least it does a 1.90 without having to have a big lead-in. Castle may be kept, depends on pilots and whether ABC decides to increase DWTS time
As much I as I would like Castle to get renewed, I don’t see it happening unless the numbers improve significantly (unlikely) or someone with the show has really good blackmail against someone at ABC (and it has to be spectacular since it’s so hard to scandalize people anymore)
Alex, while ABC doesn’t have Leno coming in to take up time, and they have a LOT of holes, they have one thing that NBC (to its detriment in my opinion) doesn’t have: LOTS of pilots. They have more pilots than any other network. 12 dramas and 14 comedies. Even if only half of these work, that’s still 9.5 hours of new programming that they have, not including any reality they may throw in. As it stands, if they dump everything from midseason, including Samantha Who? (which I don’t see them doing), they need six and a half hours for the fall. If Castle were doing moderately interesting numbers, I think they’d pick it up for 13 episodes in a heartbeat. But it’s not, and ABC is in a position where they don’t need to worry about not bringing anything back at all.
I’m not even quite sure what or why you are arguing since you say you don’t think ABC actually has a chance of bringing back Castle.
Lost should move its timeslot to 8pm, American Idol is killing the show. Can’t Believe how The Unusuals is flopping!
I wish someone could come up with something good. A title says a lot. The Unusuals?…….whatever! Better Off Ted?……sounds stoopid! Lost?! Totally Awesome!
lost’s 18-49 numbers are fantastic. considering its against idol.. even house only got 4.5 this week and it was “only” against DWTS, which isnt as big as idol. Fringe, even with idol lead in only got a 4.0.
and last night’s epi was great.
Bones is also a pleasent surprise.
“Lost should move its timeslot to 8pm, American Idol is killing the show. Can’t Believe how The Unusuals is flopping!”
even though its definitely shrinking lost’s audience, it still wins the night as the #1 scripted show.
also, if it was to be moved, i say move it to 10pm.
My family loves The Unusuals, it’s a terrific cast. Amber Tamblyn is phenomenal, I really wish people would give it a chance. I like it better than Life on Mars, I think that show would have done better had it just stayed in 1973 instead of all the hocus pocus schmazzle. LOST is exhausting, too much back and forth stuff like HEROES and people get confused and irritated by it. That’s why they aren’t succeeding and losing viewership.
“lost’s 18-49 numbers are fantastic. considering its against idol.. even house only got 4.5 this week and it was “only” against DWTS, which isnt as big as idol.”
Oh, but haven’t you heard, the Monday 8pm hour is the most competitive hour of the week.
“The Unusuals?…….whatever! Better Off Ted?……sounds stoopid! Lost?! Totally Awesome!”
That’s about as subjective as it gets. In retrospect Lost seems to have worked, but it’s a pretty average title, whereas I like The Unusuals and would wager a guess that the title is the last reason the show is tanking.
I guess 23 million is the new 30 million! (=smash hit). Especially when nothing else even gets over 20 million. Idol is still in their own league
“And Patrick I’m not entirely sure what you’re asking me when you ask ‘why advocate that for NBC when ABC in in similar trouble’. I get the impression that you think I’m advocating a Castle renewal and lets be completely clear on this now – I’m not. What I am saying is that ABC is in a different position to NBC right now. Without Leno then I’d have no real issues with NBC renewing Chuck and I don’t think we’d even be discussing them not renewing it. ”
I’m not saying necessarily you want Castle specifically. Although making the (theoretical) supposition while saying to drop the better-performing Chuck is quite confusing. BOTH networks are in big trouble. It’s obvious on NBC’s part because they’re handing over 5 hours of primetime programming to Jay Leno. (partly to keep him off ABC, too, but still…) It’s obvious on ABC’s part since it hasn’t had a rookie show not be in trouble since even before the strike started. Private Practice is the only rookie or sophomore show not in trouble, and that’s only because of the Grey’s lead-in. Hell, DWTS + Grey’s = Leno’s 5 hours, so they’re in the same boat. The only real difference is that NBC keeps shooting itself in the foot with its decision-making. Every network gets failed pilots all the time; ABC is just on a really bad streak. That, or they have people making these decisions with no sense of taste, I don’t know.
Anyway, both of them need a combination of veteran shows with consistent numbers and rookie shows that will stick around. Like Julia said, ABC is in a better position to do so with the litany of pilots in its pipeline. NBC doesn’t have that luxury. NBC actually has a comedy pilot about a Stripes-esque group of underachievers at a community college. I wish I was making that up.
NBC is the one that needs to keep more of their current shows because there’s not much coming in for them. ABC really isn’t in a good position to trash their schedule and reset, either, but they’re in a better position than NBC.
The only new show on ABC I have even remotely liked this midseason has been Better off Ted. The first episode was weak but it has been better with each successive episode.
I was excited about both Castle and the Unusuals and lasted 2 episodes of Castle and only about 3/4th of the first episode of the Unusuals. I thought my love for Nathan Fillion and Amber Tamblyn would have me supporting both of these shows but they just didn’t do it for me.
CSI new York isnt new this week coming up they have Criminal Minds a re run at 9pm and than a new one at 10pm and they wonder why people dvr cause they move everything around
if i didnt check my dvr I would have never know
In my perfect world Fox would air new episodes of Bones 7 days a week! (A person can dream, can’t they?) Love the show! Fox needs to pick a night and time and stick with it! Imagine the ratings Bones could pull if it aired consistently on the same night and time.
Fox knows that Bones has a pretty loyal audience, and to prove it the numbers and the followers, Im a big fan of this show… Can be better if the schedule stays in a day… but…well.. FOX is lucky to have this show TRUE, we deserve more respect.. whatever.. great for Bones…