| Scoreboard |  |
 |
 |
 |
 |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Rating/Share: Adults 18-49 | 2.2/7 | 1.6/5 | 1.3/4 | 1.0/4 | 0.7/2 |
| Total Viewers (million) | 9.63 | 5.00 | 4.93 | 3.14 | 1.54 |
Update: full data table now included. Dollhouse sunk yet again, this time to a 1.1 adults 18-49 rating, with 3.1 million viewers.
As usual, CBS won Friday with Ghost Whisperer, a rebounding (ratings-wise) Flashpoint, and the 100th episode of Numb3rs. ABC came in second with its scripted-free Friday night lineup of Wife Swap, Supernanny and 20/20.
You can compare with previous Friday overnight reports.
Full details:
| Time | Net | Show | 18-49 Rating/Share | Viewers (Millons) |
| 8:00 | CBS | Ghost Whisperer | 2.3/9 | 9.67 |
| ABC | Wife Swap | 1.4/5 | 4.19 | |
| FOX | Prison Break | 1.0/4 | 3.20 | |
| NBC | Howie Do It | 0.9/3 | 3.27 | |
| CW | Everybody Hates Chris | 0.7/3 | 1.73 | |
| 8:30 | NBC | Howie Do It (R) | 0.8/3 | 2.75 |
| CW | The Game | 0.8/3 | 1.86 | |
| 9:00 | CBS | Flashpoint | 2.1/7 | 9.57 |
| ABC | Supernanny | 1.6/5 | 4.61 | |
| NBC | Dateline | 1.3/4 | 5.28 | |
| FOX | Dollhouse | 1.1/4 | 3.09 | |
| CW | America’s Next Top Model (R) | 0.6/2 | 1.29 | |
| 10:00 | CBS | Numb3rs | 2.2/7 | 9.46 |
| ABC | 20/20 | 1.8/6 | 6.20 | |
| NBC | Dateline | 1.6/5 | 6.19 |
Shows are sorted by 18-49 rating in each time slot.
Nielsen TV Ratings: ©2009 The Nielsen Company. All Rights Reserved. Source Marc Berman/Mediaweek.
Definitions:
Fast Affiliate Ratings: These first national ratings, including demographics, are available at approximately 11 AM (ET) the day after telecast, and are released to subscribing customers daily. These data, from the National People Meter sample, are strictly time-period information, based on the normal broadcast network feed, and include all programming on the affiliated stations, sometimes including network programming, sometimes not. The figures may include stations that did not air the entire network feed, as well as local news breaks or cutaways for local coverage or other programming. Fast Affiliate ratings are not as useful for live programs and are likely to differ significantly from the final results, because the data reflect normal broadcast feed patterns. For example, with a World Series game, Fast Affiliate Ratings would include whatever aired from 8-11PM on affiliates in the Pacific Time Zone, following the live football game, but not game coverage that begins at 5PM PT. The same would be true of Presidential debates as well as live award shows and breaking news reports.
Rating: Estimated percentage of the universe of TV households (or other specified group) tuned to a program in the average minute. Ratings are expressed as a percent.
Share (of Audience): The percent of households (or persons) using television who are tuned to a specific program, station or network in a specific area at a specific time. (See also, Rating, which represents tuning or viewing as a percent of the entire population being measured.)
Time Shifted Viewing – Program ratings for national sources are produced in three streams of data – Live, Live+Same Day (Live+SD) and Live+7 Day. Time shifted figures account for incremental viewing that takes place with DVRs which are currently in approximately 24.4% of all U.S. TV households. Live+Same Day (Live+SD) include viewing during the same broadcast day as the original telecast, with a cut-off of 3:00AM local time when meters transmit daily viewing to Nielsen for processing. Live+7 Day ratings include incremental viewing that takes place during the 7 days following a telecast.
For more information see Numbers 101.
OMG Nick C will u finally stop taking about Renewel now??
this suckkks.
it was a good episode last night too.
i DID see xmen but at 5:00.
so i still got to see it.
Dollhouse is doomed, im afraid.
Dollhouse is dead YAY!!!
OMG. TSCC was a good lead in, though:).
Seriously, who is going to watch TV when Wolverine’s in theaters?
It’s a shame because Dollhouse really has hit its stride after some terrible early episodes, and last night’s episode was fantastic.
You cannot ask people to wait five weeks for a show to reward them for their viewership. Five weeks of stand alone episodes that Joss and co can never get back. Now it’s over.
A pretty good twist at the end of the Dollhouse episode, but a) too late for the show to start getting interesting now, b) the ending made Echo even less likeable as a character, and c) they really have nowhere to go with the story from here, the detective located the Dollhouse, Alpha revealed himself and after next week’s showdown the story is done. Only some really far-fetched and outlandish storylines could keep the show going.
PB actually beat Dollhouse in ratings? That’s pretty sad…. This week it’ll be Wolverine, next week it’ll be Star Trekk, but all in all the show is dead.
John, why exactly is it “YAY!!!” that Dollhouse is dead?
If you don’t like a show, that’s fine. You don’t have to cheer for a show possibly being cancelled. Actors, producers etc. all lose their jobs when a show is cancelled. (Some it’s a blessing as they go on to bigger careers).
I would never say “YAY” to a show I disliked being cancelled as I know others do like a show I myself do not.
Of course it bombed. Fantastic episode, and the finale will rock, hard. Frak the useless audiences. I hope they choke on JLH’s breasts.
Flashpoint did very good last night! I did not expect retention to be that high. Last nights episode was very good. If you missed it, you should check it out.
Ghost Whisperer is still a bit down, but Flashpoint had it’s best outing in months.
Dollhouse was predictably low. If it gets renewed, it will be because someone has a big check or bigger blackmail because these ratings are horrid.
Wolverine comments? Both Dollhouse and Prison Break were UP this week for total viewers (3.06 to 3.2 Prison Break, 2.99 to 3.09 for Dollhouse). They dropped a point in the 18-49 demos but overall ratings are unchanged from last week. I’m guessing that means the 18-49 year olds went out and the older demos tuned in. Let’s also not forget that Wolverine had pretty bad word of mouth around the net, between the leaked work print and the plethora of bad reviews (it’s sitting at 37% on Rottentomatoes right now). There’s also been bad weather throughout the Midwest and East Coast, rain, thunderstorms, etc. And finally, CBS and ABC saw gains last night from last week, FOX just treaded water.
It adds up to Wolverine not having much of an effect. Now if we see the ratings drop next week because of Star Trek, which is getting lots of positive buzz so far, that makes sense. Buzz matters (this is what I get for surfing the net so much, sigh).
Remi, total viewers don’t really matter, but it does look like a few more people watched PB. But I’m pretty sure 18-49 rating doesn’t matter much either when you’re talking a 1.1 vs a 1.0.
i dont get why anyone is happy to see a show do bad?
Dollhouse is not cancel.
They have no life.
FOX should pull both shows now. they wont but they should. FOx should renew TSCC it was doing better than both of these crap shows.
“FOX should pull both shows now. they wont but they should. FOx should renew TSCC it was doing better than both of these crap shows.”
All 3 won’t be back.
I hate dollhouse is on friday nights…..I had to wait until this morning when Fox uploaded it….Having to work every Friday is a bummer…..But its life and Friday has definitly killed this show….On a brighter note I am loving this show more by the week….Too bad people do not realize it takes time for the great ones to build up……
Remi, again – if you seriously can’t see where it can go from here, no wonder the show failed to draw in bigger audiences. I don’t need safe predictable crap every week, but obviously most people do.
Charles, they’re probably thinking that if Dollhouse gets cancelled, TSCC stays, or something else like that. It’s the same nonsense with Chuck fans. One show getting the axe doesn’t make your own show any safer. And for the record, I’m a TSCC fan, I haven’t posted anything about it here because the show isn’t on the air right and it’s not germane to a discussion over last night’s ratings. This is supposed to be about analysis, not “YAY THAT SHOW SUCKED OR THIS SHOW IS DOING WELL”!
Robert, I brought up the raw viewer numbers to show that there’s really no difference this week to the next. Personally, I hate the break down of ratings by a tenth of a point, but that’s the scientist in me coming to the fore again.
The only thing these FOX ratings show in regard to TSCC is that a) TSCC was a better leadin for Dollhouse than Prison Break and b) that TSCC was the best performer of the 3 (meaning it’s entirely possible it would have beaten Dollhouse in ratings had their positions been reversed with Dollhouse at 8 and TSCC at 9, come to think of it, that’s probably true for Mondays with TSCC and Prison Break given how Prison Break is performing in TSCC’s slot). I’m sure someone else has made this point before and I’m sorry to repeat it.
Unless someone directly replies to the above paragraph, that’s the last you’ll hear from me on this subject, I’d rather get back to the topic at hand, shows being broadcast now.
Yes the detective will defeat Alpha and save the girl in the finale, but then aliens will abduct Echo an he can spend season 2 searching for her along with Han Solo and a lady vampire slayer. Seriously…
How can anyone think 3.2 is good how dumb.
Let’s just be honest, shows like Dollhouse will never have big mainstream followings. They just will not. Fox greenlighted a show they knew wouldn’t have much of an audience so it made no real business sense from the get go. I’m a fan and really like it but shows like this belong on FX, USA or the SCI-FI channel. We all know the problem with that argument is the production costs are too high for cable. Bottom line- Dollhouse was created to fail and its small but loyal following loses at the end of the day because you have to believe it will be canceled.
Deals like the one Friday Night Lights received (NBC and Direct TV sharing production costs which saved the show) are great but they don’t seem to be happening for any other program. If Dollhouse doesen’t get a series FINAL that will be a total BUMMER! If canceled it appears that it wont.
chuck
And I still hear people say “The verdict is still open on Dollhouse”….
RJ says: FOX should pull both shows now. they wont but they should. FOx should renew TSCC it was doing better than both of these crap shows.
Multiple good parts to that.
Jack and RJ you are so right both those Friday night shows. PB especially are waay horrible why anyone is watching them is beyond stupid!But FOX was pretty clueless by keeping PB on this year.
Hmm… I guess TV guide was right when they gave TSCC better chances for renewal than Dollhouse. TSCC finished stronger than Dollhouse and PB and it was clearly a better lead-in. Here’s to long shots!
So, I tuned in for Alan Tudyk and I don’t really see how people still make that “OMG, the first five episodes turned everyone off” argument with a straight face, because has the show changed? Sure. Has it gotten better? Not really. And even if, it obviously has not gotten good enough. While you can blame the fact only 4 million people were still around for episode six on Fridays and FOX and Watchmen all you want, should it not have stopped losing viewers at some point at the very least?
Thanks entertainmenttodayandbeyond, I was wondering when someone was going to drag Chuck into this.
Just a random observation, but do any publicity photos of Dollhouse exist aside from the one used here? I’m going to start having nightmares if I see Fran Kranz (worst actor EVAR?) in that awful outfit one more time.
Some people might be glad to see Dollhouse cancelled because they find some elements of it to be offensive. A valid reason, IMO.
I wonder if the mini MynetworkTV beat FOX last night?
Haha, if the excuse this week is Wolverine, then next week will be Star Trek.
yeah, then will be Angels & Demons, Terminator, Up, Harry Potter, Transformers
Don’t forget “nice weather”.
@ puredieselbc:
“You cannot ask people to wait five weeks for a show to reward them for their viewership. Five weeks of stand alone episodes that Joss and co can never get back. Now it’s over.”
– Dollhouse is probably doomed but the early episodes were due to FOX’s insistence. Joss had other ideas. Now that the show has hit a stride, it seems to me that FOX should grant a second season to see if the ratings improve. They won’t, of course, but it’s unfair to blame the show’s early episodes on Joss. He was only doing what FOX told him to do if he wanted to get the show on the air.
It’s too bad. Dollhouse was intelligent, thought provoking TV.
Hudson, check my previous posts, I already debunked any Wolverine excuse. There was a lot of negative buzz surrounding that movie among the SCI-FI crowd because of the leaked print and negative reviews. Star Trek is another matter entirely and may well make a bigger difference, it’s got better buzz and reviews, and the Star Trek fans are the biggest group of SCI-FI fans around the world.
im not surprised flashpoint did so well last night.
it was an amazing episode. you should check it out if you missed it last night.
I think everybody and their Moms called d’house for non-renewal when it got shifted to Fridays. Even the most brassed balled Whedonites saw this coming and dealt with it before the show even aired. I did like it though and I had fun watching it.
I won’t buy the DVD though unless I get some nice commentary selection. Alan Tudyk & Whedon bantering over the final 2 eps would be just fine for me.
ABOUT FLASHPOINT:
“it was an amazing episode. you should check it out if you missed it last night.”
100% agree!
skyroom80 wrote:”- Dollhouse is probably doomed but the early episodes were due to FOX’s insistence. Joss had other ideas. Now that the show has hit a stride, it seems to me that FOX should grant a second season to see if the ratings improve. They won’t, of course, but it’s unfair to blame the show’s early episodes on Joss. He was only doing what FOX told him to do if he wanted to get the show on the air.”
The same thing they did to Joss with Firefly which is why I wonder why he decided to return to the same network that screwed him over the first time? Yeah I do blame Joss.
This is 2009- RATINGS do not improve. That was a concept for the 70’s 80′ and 90’s. That theory worked for shows like Mash and Seinfield but it does not and will not hold water ever again. The world is a different place. Just way too many channels and programs to watch.
chuck
“It’s too bad. Dollhouse was intelligent, thought provoking TV.”
Exactly. I spent the 1st episode scratching my head and wondering how this was ever got to see the light of day.
ETAB, “ratings do not improve” is demonstrably wrong. Off the top of my head, NCIS, and several of CBS’s Monday comedies are up this season vs. last.
Still, the “the network needs to have patience” is easy to say when a show’s ratings are acceptable and you allow it to grow into better than acceptable. When a show’s ratings are not acceptable, patience is in short supply.
The whole TSCC was a better lead-in than PB is pretty useless since you’re comparing ratings from a month ago, before everything started dropping (across all nights and networks) due to the nice weather or returning cable shows, or whatever. I’d bet that if TSCC was still on now, it’d be getting the same ratings as PB is getting now.
I agree with Bill, the patience argument makes a lot of sense for a show with positive reviews and mediocre ratings, particularly if the network has room for it. The argument does not make sense for a show with mediocre reviews or bad ratings or a network with a full slate.
I’m surprised nobody’s mentioned the 100th episode of Numb3rs in any of the comments so far. For me it was the highlight of the night given the magnitude of what Charlie was trying to do in the wake of the previous episode when Don was injured. With all the nods to the pilot episode five years ago and the reappearance of Josh Gad as the conspiracy theorist consultant from earlier in the season, it was a well rounded episode that delivered on many levels: from David being in charge of the team again, to Larry’s cosmological insights and ultimately, in the ending itself which perfectly showed the mind of the serial killer at the heart of the story.
It was good to read that Numb3rs’ numbers [no pun intended] held up again, so fingers crossed Numb3rs will be back in the Fall for a sixth season.
Bill I don’t disagree with your point in a few instances(like NCIS) but in the case of Dollhouse ratings are not going to improve. Its a thought provoking sc-fi show with a limited audience. Fox will never turn that 3.5 million viewers into 7 million. The majority of shows on a down trajectory continue to trend down. CBS skews to an older demographic and there ratings are very good for the majority of there shows. The other networks have a few hits but alot of misses. If a new show starts off weak on ABC or NBC it most likely will never recover.
chuck
Dave, Numb3rs is pretty much a lock for next year. CBS is winning every Friday night in viewers and the demo, so they have to be happy with how things are.
Lats nite was the best episode of Flashpoint ever! Had me on the edge of my seat. America needs more Canadian shows on Broadcast.
I am hearing that Dollhouse is still “weirdly on the bubble”! My source is someone who knows someone who read a comment on a website so am pretty sure there’s a good chance it’s coming back! Yay! They think that if the show’s renewed, it will spark huge interest in the show! FOX has used this strategy in the past with shows like Tru Calling and The Loop! Plus, the show is doing ten percent better in the demo than the series premiere of The Return of Jezebel James last spring, so who can ask for more?! Plus the show’s going to be at ComicCon, where bazillions of people will learn about the show and fall in love with it! FOX hasn’t scheduled any reruns this summer, but I’m sure that’s an oversight and starting in June the show will air reruns that will draw even more viewers! I can’t wait to see the ratings for the show in reruns: I’m thinking seven million viewers at least!
If Dollhouse IS in trouble, though, it’s because it’s much too smart for the average viewer! Thank Joss, though, that I’m an above average viewer! I’m grateful Joss didn’t dumb the show down, but I do know it made it harder for people to get into!
Dollhouse is the best thing that has ever, ever, ever been created!
It’s over for Dollhouse. Which is terrible. Makes me wonder who the hell has Nielson boxes. Too bad, because last nights ep was the best of the series so far, really good stuff. It will end strong. Honest answer, though, this is a show that needs to be on a network like FX instead of Fox, where challenging, tricky material can get more play.
First two seasons of Numb3rs were low, and if memory serves has always been on Friday night, and after 100 eps its still going strong. Though it was getting kinda slow this year and cast changes did weaken it from early years.
Dollhouse, although I watch it and like it, is not really that good, bad acting and boring story lines will keep it sinking even with the twists and alphas return.
Movies vs TV listen with all the tech today if a person really wants to watch something they can and do, just because a movie comes out in theatre doesn’t mean its going to kill TV that night. There are so many other ways to see stuff now, I follow atleast 15 shows, between downloading, DVR and live cable I watch them all, movies, haven’t been to one in about 7 years, why would I pay $10 or more to find out something sucks, I just wait a few weeks and get the low quality cam, TV is where its at, every week something new and exciting to taste.
YESTERDAY’S EPISODE PRISON BREAK 4.19 WAS AWESOME!
THE BEST EPISODE OF SEASON 4!!!
RATINGS SUCKS. I DON’T CARE ABOUT RATINGS.
Yet you come to a site dedicated to ratings…. Oh, and you might want to have someone look at your keyboard, it appears to be stuck on caps lock.
Glad to see FP hold b/c it deserves a renewal for a third season.
Its funny because I really think MyNet beat older brother FOX last night with an amazing edition of Smackdown!
FOX should move SD! over right now and renew Dollhouse with a better lead-in.
“FOX should move SD! over right now and renew Dollhouse with a better lead-in.”
Renew Dollhouse? ON what grounds? No lead-in can save it, it already had two, and it did worse than many shows that had none.
I have to laugh at the people that said TSCC was a bad lead in. I think it is Dollhouse that brings other shows’ ratings down. They should move WWE Smackdown to Fox.
I wonder if Dollhouse were on another network,like ABC before Lost,how much better it would do.Obviously it would be night and day due to the fact that it would no longer be on Friday’s,so here’s to hoping that another network looks at it with more promise than Fox did.
My speculation? Joss’s Biggest Fan is none other than Joss himself, mocking the show to see a rise out of the fans who are up in arms to defend it. But hey, I could be wrong. The sad thing is it’d be more riveting than most of TSCC’s second season. Plus, being a troll on a message board and trying to piss people off is absolutely last season.
Someone posted here a few weeks ago saying that FOX was only going to air the SEASON finale for Prison Break and not the SERIES finale? I didn’t really pay much attention to it at the time but I’ve heard it a second time now on another site…Anyone know what that’s all about?
I would watch Alpine Fields 100 times rather than watch Eliza Doucheku for another season of anything.
Eliza Dushku is a wonderful actress. Anyway, 20th Century Fox Television ought to move Dollhouse to HBO or Showtime. I know that won’t happen.
8:00
Ghost Whisperer (CBS): 9.7 million, A18-49 2.3
Prison Break (FOX): 3.2 million, A18-49 1.0
Wife Swap (ABC): 4.2 million, A18-49 1.4
Howie Do It (NBC; two repeats): 3.3 million, A18-49 0.9
9:00
Flashpoint (CBS): 9.6 million, A18-49 2.1
Supernanny (ABC): 4.6 million, A18-49 1.6
Dateline (NBC; expanded edition): 5.8 million, A18-49 1.5
Dollhouse (FOX): 3.1 million, A18-49 1.1
10:00
Numb3rs (CBS): 9.6 million, A18-49 2.2
20/20 (ABC): 6.2 million, A18-49 1.8
good to see the numbers come up on Cbs and also Flashpoint had me on edge to and Numbers was excallent to
my gosh if i read one more comment about how TSCC should be renewed because its doing better than PB and Dollhouse i’m going to go insane.
It’s like saying I have herpes but at least I dont have syphilis. It doesn’t matter you still have an std.
It is a sad, sad world when the festering pile of rat feces that Prison Break has become the last two seasons still gets better ratings than Dollhouse. Ugh.
what does the incredible shrinking dollhouse numbers do for terminator’s chances???
sorry jimmy…
CBS’s 3 series are consistent, prospects for Flashpoint in the same slot next year look good, and Dollhouse is done.
Even if Dollhouse is cancelled, at least Fox still has Fringe. Besides, Fringe is a much better show than Dollhouse anyway. Better writing and better mythology. Also, the episodes are a lot more scarier than Dollhouse!
Dollhouse inst suppose to be scary dumbass
No name calling please!
I wonder what Nick C. has to say about Dollhouse’s chances. What are you hearing from inside Fox, Nick C.?
@Holly – I hope so, that Numb3rs is a lock for next year. It’s had me hooked since the pilot episode because it’s just so different to the other law enforcement shows.
@Mike the Canadian – I agree with your comments about Numb3rs. The third season was where it really started to get interesting with Colby’s backstory and that awesome third season finale. I’d certainly agree that cast changes have weakened Numb3rs’ fifth season: losing Diane Farr (Megan) and adding Sophina Brown (Nikki). And as was proved beautifully on the 100th episode when David stole Charlie’s thunder to explain the lawn sprinkler analogy to the audience, the Nikki character just doesn’t get how important math is to the show. If Diane Farr wasn’t joining Californication’s third season in the Fall, I would have liked to see her return as Megan for the (i.e. if there is a) sixth season.
@ThePattern – I agree: Fringe has been the best new show this season. I love that show too and was pleased that they’ve already started filming the second season. I’m so looking forward to the final scene of the season finale when “you-know-who” makes his all-too-brief debut.
Leonard Nimoy and yeah, I’m really looking forward to that!
Upon reading these comments, I must confess surprise that some of the above people have figured out how to use the Internet.
Is program _____ bad/good? No. You may like it or you may not, but that has no relevance to the quality of any show. If you believe otherwise then you have an overdeveloped ego. Nothing more.
Anyone who takes pleasure in someone else’s misfortune utterly lacks class and is not worth paying attention to.
Might show ______ have performed better on another night/time slot? Maybe. But we do not know and have no way of knowing. Anyone who claims otherwise is delusional.
Terminator consistently brought in lower ratings than Dollhouse when it preceded Dollhouse. If you believe that caused Dollhouse to have negatively affected Terminator then you are clearly incapable of rational thought.
Prison Break has been airing it’s final episodes (following a long hiatus) in the time slot before Dollhouse and has brought in a small audience. If you believe that that constitutes a good lead-in then I have a good pyramid scheme to sell you that is a “sure thing”. If you believe that Dollhouse has negatively affected PB then I feel secure that you will take me up on my offer.
Dollhouse was not brought by Joss Whedon to Fox. Eliza Dushku had a deal with Fox and they brought in Joss Whedon.
Fox had heavy creative control over the initial episodes and they turned out as they did due to Fox’s input. In retrospect was that a mistake? Possibly.
Are all of these factors (and others such as Fox Studios’ interest in seeing Dollhouse renewed) enough to grant it a reprieve and bring it back? Probably not, the odds are slim, but it is possible. And we just won’t know until the announcement is made or someone with solid inside information comes forth.
Is it possible for Eliza Dushku to return to the series if 20th Century Fox is still the distributor of the show, if another network picks it up. Why? oes she have a contract with Fox the studio or Fox the network?
Correction: Is it possible for Eliza Dushku to return to the series if 20th Century Fox is still the distributor of the show, if another network picks it up. Why? does she have a contract with Fox the studio or Fox the network?
The Pattern: yes she does. she has a contract with Fox since 2003, but the contract is over in july, so if an other network picks up the show, she will be free to follow it. i really hope scy fy to pick DLH up
i meant Fox the network
@AO,
Unlike Dollhouse, TSCC didn’t have a lead-in and it was up against the most popular show of the night in its timeslot and yet it still finished stronger than Dollhouse. Then they tried giving Dollhouse an already established lead-in that has been on for 4 seasons and the ratings plummeted further. Dollhouse has NO argument for renewal. FOX has scrapped PB and King of the Hill, it will definitely scrap “Sit down, shut up”, and very likely both Dollhouse and TSCC. If by some miracle they decide not to cancel both, they will only keep one and by all logic TSCC will be it. Terminator as a franchise has much more profit potential and as well as an insanely fanatical fanbase, whether or not you take T4 itself into consideration. Dollhouse disappointed even hardcore Whedon fans who still watch but not very passionately, and they will not be spending much money on Dollhouse products.
I’ve watched all 11 episodes of Dollhouse to date (and I’ll watch next weeks finales) and whilst I’ve enjoyed a couple of them last nights episode just cemented my desire for this show not be renewed. I hated it and it was a fantastic representation of everything that’s been wrong with Dollhouse from day one. In basic terms it feels like its been plotted by someone with ADHD who can’t focus on one plot or character long enough to develop them to a point where the audience actually cares about them – its just everything thrown at the wall as fast as possible in the hope something sticks.
The Alpha plot has been so rushed and underdeveloped that I couldn’t care less about him or why he went rouge. And the Alpha ‘twist’ reveal last night was horribly predictable. The Echo/Caroline character has been developed so poorly that I don’t care about her fate. The FBI agent is so poorly written and cast that I don’t know anything about him, why he wants to bring down the Dollhouse or why he is so deadest on saving Caroline only that I don’t care about him at all. The other characters are 2D piles of nothing that lack any consistency and exist purely to provide disposition and advance the plot and most of them are the botched ‘greatest hits’ of Joss Whedon – him pulling characters from his other shows and hoping no one will notice.
The entire show is just a giant train wreck with even the ‘great’ episodes being nothing more than ok. You take the fight sequence out of last nights episode and it was almost a complete disaster. I say almost because at least Alan Tudyk was good.
I’m glad the shows dropped lower this week. It should have.
On another note anyone that thinks Dollhouse bombing is good news for Terminator is insane. The only way you get good news for Terminator is if every other show on Fox bombs to the extent that Dollhouse has next week and that’s not going to happen.
Dollhouse pulling slightly worse ratings than the really bad ratings of Terminator means nothing. Neither show should come back and unless Fox goes completely insane neither show will come back. Dollhouse pulling worse numbers does not excuse Terminators horrible numbers.
LOL@Joss’s Biggest Fan
Max, you forgot to consider that Fox owns Dollhouse, while it does not own Terminator. So, actually Fox would profit more from having Dollhouse than Terminator. And, Dollhouse is not that bad Alex. Also, Buffy’s 1st season wasn’t great either.
The problem is the concept of the Dollhouse is better suited for an anthology series like The Outer Limits (1995). In fact, there was an episode quite like that which starred Ryan Phillippe and Peter Donat called, “Straight and Narrow.” It was about a military school that imprints a computer chip into students brains and trains them to be soldiers and sends them out to assassinate people. Believe me, the episode was far creepier than anything in Dollhouse.
@ ThePattern, the fact that FOX owns Dollhouse just means that they have to pay for it themselves and that there is no third party that can lobby in its favor. Since TSCC is owned by WB, WB can offer a lower licensing fee if it wants the show to keep airing and it can lobby for the show if it believes it beneficial for the Terminator franchise to stay active. The advantage there still goes to TSCC.
I never heard anybody say anything bad about the first season of Buffy until Dollhouse came on.
I can’t believe the fans of TSCC, they celebrate the bad ratings of Dollhouse? When in actuality they are within single digits % wise of each other. They are like spin doctors over there. The death of Cameron might help JF prove to FOX he will retool the show and make it more FAN friendly. TSCC with Cameron seems to appeal mainly to a group of males that aren’t in the demo Fox cares about. Single jobless live at home cellar dwellars.
Chris the TV Sage that’s pretty amazing considering that some of Buffy’s first season was down right horrid.
Fox is going to green light a season 3 of SCC, just so they can keep Summer Glau under contract.
OMG!!! Episode 19 of Prison Break was awesome!!! It’s a shame the ratings are bad, because this season is in my opinion better than season 3. This episode reminded me of the tension from season 1 and 2.
Fox pays less for a show it owns, not the other way around, Max. Advantages goes to Dollhouse.
That makes no sense Thecolours. They could just offer her a part in something that people actually want to watch.
The only part left for for Summer Glau is that of Alison, a 21 year old resistance fighter. This will appeal to more Terminator fans, a young Sarah Connor type personality. Cameron will be remembered as a betrayer.
8:30
NBC Howie Do It (R) 0.8/3 2.75
CW The Game 0.8/3 1.86
The CW tied NBC im the all important demo? WOW!
edit from last comment:
im should be IN
“notty22 says: …”
Your point of view, which has been overwhelmingly negative towards the clear fan favorite.
They wouldn’t have killed off Cameron, even I don’t believe Friedman is that stupid. Also if you followed interviews and such, Cameron doubted herself and her ability to protect John.
I suppose posting it here makes sense, as they keep banning you from other TSCC sites.
To Max Sleven:
My comment was that “Terminator consistently brought in lower ratings than Dollhouse when it preceded Dollhouse.” and then when looking at Prison Break, I stated that neither constituted a good lead-in. Here are the numbers from this very site:
Feb 13th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.4/5 3.90
Feb 20th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.3/5 3.84
Feb 27th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.2/4 3.42
March 6th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.0/4 2.96
March 13th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.2/4 3.5
March 20th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.3/5 3.65
March 27th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.3/5 3.83
April 3rd: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.3/5 3.35
April 10th: Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles 1.3/5 3.56
Feb 13th: Dollhouse 2.0/6 4.73
Feb 20th: Dollhouse 1.7/5 4.22
Feb 27th: Dollhouse 1.6/5 4.13
March 6th: Dollhouse 1.5/5 3.55
March 13th: Dollhouse 1.6/5 4.3
March 20th: Dollhouse 1.5/5 4.13
March 27th: Dollhouse 1.3/4 3.87
April 3rd: Dollhouse 1.4/5 3.49
April 10th: Dollhouse 1.4/4 3.56
In your opinion, are those the numbers of a good lead-in? If you tell a random person that a 9:00 PM show will have a lead-in with numbers like those then do you honestly seek to claim that that they will be optimistic that their show has a good chance of success?
You say, “Unlike Dollhouse, TSCC didn’t have a lead-in and it was up against the most popular show of the night in its timeslot…”. That is true, in the same way that Dollhouse has had it’s own challenges, but nowhere does it disprove my contention that T: SCC was a poorly performing lead-in. I have watched every episode of Terminator aired thus far and own the 1st Season DVD, but that does not prevent me from looking at those numbers and seeing that the show did not perform well based on the ratings that the networks look to.
You then say “and yet it still finished stronger than Dollhouse”. Really? I look at the week to week results and imo there were two weeks (March 27th and April 10th) where the ratings for both shows were essentially the same. Every other week Dollhouse clearly had higher ratings.
“Then they tried giving Dollhouse an already established lead-in that has been on for 4 seasons and the ratings plummeted further”.
April 24th: Prison Break 1.0/4 3.05
May 1st : Prison Break 1.0/4 3.20
So you are saying that THOSE are the numbers of a good lead-in? The last few episodes of a series that the network is burning off?
“Dollhouse has NO argument for renewal”. NO. I gave you some, you just choose to dismiss those arguments. But I would argue that Terminator, which has had LOWER ratings than Dollhouse has had and has now failed on two different days has even less of an argument than Dollouse does.
“FOX has scrapped PB and King of the Hill, it will definitely scrap “Sit down, shut up”, and very likely both Dollhouse and TSCC.” I finally agree with you about something.
“If by some miracle they decide not to cancel both, they will only keep one”. That seems quite likely, but again, we have no way of knowing for sure. Anything is possible, but I would agree that brining both back seems extremely unlikely.
“and by all logic TSCC will be it.” Your logic perhaps, but why? Because it had lower ratings than Dollhouse? Because it was already given a chance on two different nights and failed to perform well on either?
“Terminator as a franchise has much more profit potential and as well as an insanely fanatical fanbase, whether or not you take T4 itself into consideration.” But it seems to have failed to live up to that potential. Where are the toys and trading cards and tie-in books for T: SCC? And wouldn’t all of that profit go to the other studio that owns Terminator? The only thing that Fox Network receives is revenue from the Show’s ratings, right?
“Dollhouse disappointed even hardcore Whedon fans who still watch but not very passionately, and they will not be spending much money on Dollhouse products”. Link please? Some fans were disappointed. But some fans have always been disappointed. Some Buffy fans only like Buffy, or only Buffy/Angel. Some Angel fans don’t like anything else, including Buffy. Many Firefly fans have no interest in any of the other properties. We have no accurate idea of what the entire Dollhouse fan base might or might not spend on products or how passionately the entire fan base does or doesn’t feel. Your contention here is entirely speculative and I could just as easily reply with “T: SCC disappointed even hardcore Terminator fans who still watch but not very passionately, and they will not be spending much money on T: SCC products”.
FWIW I wasn’t impressed with last night’s episode of Dollhouse and suspect it probably put viewers off. Sure, it was “intense”, but it was also disorganized and raised some peculiar, non-arc related, questions, such as why an entity that supposedly is paid millions to hire out its “actives” is doing providing therapy for a problem-child orphan. Who’s paying? Who in the Dollhouse world would be that interested? [I'd love to be proven wrong, and this is actually some interesting new arc, but...]
I suspect the audience was down in part because last week’s episode was relatively weak (though not a bad episode all in all), and in part because of the major blockbuster released on Friday. I don’t see next week’s episode as likely to have much of a gain, if any, on this week’s figures.
Shame. With the initial five unrepresentative episodes, the Friday scheduling, and being paired with the tragedy that was T:SCC, Dollhouse really never stood much of a chance on its merits. And the worst part is that T:SCC, despite everything, probably has a greater likelihood (however slim) of coming back in some form. It’s, at least, independent of Fox, and so its makers can consider making low budget follow-ups for the cable networks, something that’s just not going to happen with DH.
and that is just a number FOX won’t ignore…
if they do Murdoch should fire everyone involved in the decision… REMOTE FREE TV or not.
Nick, why is 1.1 so much worse than 1.2? (I know it went up to 1.3 in the finals last week, but even when all we saw was 1.2 you were saying it still looked good for renewal.)
It’s probably not so much the exact number as it is the downward trend. Unfortunately, Dollhouse seems only fit to shed viewers at this point.
The strange thing about Dollhouse is that Fox continues to promote it, including, apparently, an “extra-special” interview with Tudyk next week. That’s why I think it possible they may decide to give it a short season renewal, 13 maybe, for branding reasons. I think that’s even more likely if all of their new shows are safe bets, as it will change the tenor of the critics’ reviews, since they’ll have to talk about Fox’s experiment in giving Dollhouse a second order. But it will still be a strange decision if it happens. It certainly won’t be a decision based on any interpretation of the numbers, though.
LOL @ Joss’s biggest fan.
im hoping your being sarcastic.. but i do miss your poetry!
Yay flashpoint! great ratings, and a great episode.
if NBC replaced HD with L&O repeats, who thinks they would get more viewers?
[raises hand]
Goodbye Dollhouse.
The X Files was Fox’s worst rated show in 1993 and they took a chance on that and gave it a 2nd season!
GW,Howie,and Flashpoint are fantastic tv shows even the repeats!…
Obviously, Fox won’t pull Prison Break as only two episodes remain until it’s done for good so they might as well air them in order to not anger fans. Dollhouse should go as it’s a terrible show with horrid acting (Dushku is hot, which is the only reason she even has a career as if she wasn’t attractive, she would have nothing because she is so incredibly bad at acting).
DOLLHOUSE went up to 1.3 in the finals last week?
Dushku is a very good actress and they should be lucky to have her!
Unlike Alex, I did like Friday’s episode of Dollhouse and I WAS taken totally by surprise when Tudyk became Alpha. I can see problems with last night’s episode, but all in all it was pretty good. The question will be what kind of cliff hanger can they provide in the last episode to suggest a season 2 (not that a season 2 is going to happen with these numbers, of course.)
Chad: “They wouldn’t have killed off Cameron, even I don’t believe Friedman is that stupid.”
Yes, I believe he IS that stupid. I didn’t use to, but since the finale, yes, he IS.
“Also if you followed interviews and such, Cameron doubted herself and her ability to protect John.”
Summer tells people what Josh tells her to tell people. I don’t think she ever understood the character other than what Josh told her to believe. She also had a romantic take on Cameron’s nature since she’s female.
Her returning as Allison Young would be a complete waste of her talent. Contrary to Notty’s dislike, Cameron was THE best character on the show and had the most storytelling potential, while Summer is THE most popular character on the show. Friedman acknowledged that to some extent by giving her two episodes to herself, but I think he resented the fact that his beloved Sarah Connor ended up being called a bitch by even the fans at one point.
And he certainly wanted to screw with the Jameron shippers, as that travesty of a “sex scene” in the finale proves beyond all doubt.
Remember, at WonderCon they showed a spoiler video with seconds from the scene between John and Cameron at the very end, JUST to stir up the Jameron shippers. THEN they do this hideously bad scene in the finale. It was enough to make me puke. It had to be deliberate. They KNEW the show was done for and they were just shafting the fans at that point just to tick off Fox.
Because Friedman doesn’t have the cojones to take responsibility for screwing up a guaranteed franchise spinoff like Terminator beyond all recognition.
He’s still BSing everybody by claiming he’s going to pitch a season 3 to WB and Fox when he HAS to know by now that the show is done for. He’s a BS artist, nothing more.
As for Dollhouse, it’s done for. Too many mistakes, too few viewers. It’s over as much as TSCC is over. I just hope the final episode is better than the crap TSCC did for a finale.
Sad to see the ratings so low for P-Break, but it was expected…
Best episode of this season BY FAR this week, hopefully it finishes strong.
Haven’t read all the comments yet…any mention of Chuck?
Just kidding, all you Chucksters…i would have put a winking smiley-face, but i don’t know how
actually dollhouse is produced by: 20th century fox (Fox); Mutant Enemy (Joss Whedon); Diva Production (Eliza Dushku); the cost of any episode is between 1,2/2 million dollar. fox pays a third of the episode
wiesengrund, I guess not. I thought Nick C. had announced at some point last week that it did, but I just checked, and, no, 1.2.
@Shelley,
Prison Break does better than DOLLHOUSE because DOLLHOUSE is a terrible show! PB has loyal fans that will watch to the very end. Friday’s episode was AWESOME!!!!! And at least we got 4 great seasons of PB. Won’t be happening for DOLLHOUSE though. Bye bye boring DOLLHOUSE!!!!!! lol
I was getting fairly bored of tscc until i saw the finale
looking forward to next season even tho i doubt there will be one
Even movies with bad buzz (i.e. “Watchmen”) can have a killer opening weekend. I’ll be interested to see what the DVR numbers look like for all the shows (but primarily Dollhouse). I really enjoy the show but can’t say I expect a renewal. And re: season two possible plotlines, anyone who’s seen (or read) any of Joss’ work knows how adept he is at writing. He could blow the Earth up and still come up with a believable way to continue the show.
Don’t get me wrong, Courtney. I LOVED Prison Break’s first season, even liked its second. But the third and fourth were horrific. And yes, Dollhouse isn’t as good as Whedon’s other shows (I don’t even watch Dollhouse) but Fox’s treatment of it was pretty unfair from the start – making Joss revamp the pilot into what they wanted, not what he wanted? Dumping the show on Fridays? Unfair.
Lisa, do you have a source on that? And when you say Fox pays a third of each episode, do you mean the network is paying a third (so only approximately $400-700k) or that 20th Century Fox is discounting each episode by one third?
If the former, I can definitely see how the show could be profitable for them.
@AO, when counting DVR+7 viewership, TSCC finished stronger than Dollhouse.
Does anyone know what Fox changed about the pilot? I find the prostitution element of the show to be its fundamental flaw. I’ve found every other use of the dollhouse tech compelling except custom hooker. If they wanted the Dollhouse to be villainous or at least ethically neutral, they should have just given the dolls terrorist assignments or something.
I just don’t understand how anyone thought it appropriate to launch a show with an ep about child molestation. Yeah, I just worked hard all week, let me check out this show that cuts from shots of ED’s butt on the dance floor to a little girl getting kidnapped by a rapist and some suckers. They made the show too much about a brothel, hookers, pimps, and johns when it didn’t have to be about that at all. Instead, they want us to look past or beyond that. Like I can when they throw in child prostitution as a filler storyline this week? Oh that’s right, we’re helping her get better by sending an adult hooker to show her it will be ok one day. WAY too much rape on this show. Guess season six of Buffy wasn’t enough for JW.
It’s a shame. Fox may have marketed it originally as the Summer/Eliza block; but for me it was the Lena/Olivia block and that I will miss. Dichen too
I’d watch Lena eat cereal so it was never a problem for me, but both Joss and Josh need to understand that most people don’t want to wallow in crazy people’s heads for entertainment. At most, they want cops to catch or kill them. Well I guess we’ll all be smarter than fifth graders in the fall.
@shelly What was unfair about it? They’ve been plenty fair to Joss Whedon over the years, shelling out big time bucks for just the pilot of Firefly–which tanked from the beginning. People seem to forget that the numbers were NEVER good for Firefly, even at the pilot. Then they forked out $50M for a movie which didn’t do well. Now we have Dollhouse, another ratings failure and this one didn’t even have critics on its side, unlike Firefly. The guy has had 3 chances with a major studio and flubbed them all.
Same principle here, there was little interest in the show from the beginning outside of Joss fans, most of which were alienated by the writing and exploitive aspects of the show. He should have passed on it from the beginning.
Jinzy I couldn’t agree more. Joss Whedon writes small shows: Buffy, Angel successful small shows on a small network WB/CW; Firefly, Dollhouse unsuccessful small shows on a big network, Fox. Can we see a pattern here? If the man would just stick to the tv environment that appreciates his work and stop trying to reach “the masses” who will NEVER get his type of show.
You know they didn’t air the Firefly pilot at the beginning right? It was like the 8th episode or something, totally aired out of order.
actually, firefly numbers for the pilot were 6.2 million. better than dark angel the year before. and The X files ranked 6.9 million with the first episode. firefly was produced by universal and mutant enemy with a low budget. it opened the week with 15 million in the box office, and selt million in the dvd edition.
christian seehausen, if you go to any whedon site, or dollhouse site such as IMDB, you ll find out. i don know how much money fox will do with dollhouse, but now i see how much they spent: too little for the treatment they reserved to the show.
sorry! i meant serenity, the movie of firefly, was produced by universal and mutant enemy etc. etc.
i just saw Fox Twitter page and it mentions the Eonline poll of TSCC winning it. Could this mean anything?? God i hope so. We need a season 3.
I saw Dollhouse today. Episode 11 was very good. But way to late to make the show interesting. Next week feels like from the trailer at least the series finale. The show had a great idea but very like Bionic woman last year just couldnt make it work. The storys are just 2 dull. The only reason i kept watching was Paul trying to take the dollhouse down. otherwise i wouldve stopped watching.
@RuzaRoos:
Apparently you’d rather not be challenged and made to think about moral issues when you watch a TV show. That’s fine and it’s your prerogative. But that doesn’t mean the writers don’t know exactly what they doing in dealing with the issue, it doesn’t mean that they’re somehow supporting prostitution and rape (newsflash: They’re not), and it doesn’t mean the show needs to change to fit *your* expectations in particular; whether a show with a premise like Dollhouse’s can ever be financially successful is another issue, but I’d argue there are too many other factors in play to pin it on this one particular thing.
In fact, if the show DIDN’T deal with the prostitution angle, I would call it unrealistic and dishonest as to how the technology would actually be used by a clandestine black market business.
Julia, I thought the 1.2 was pretty damn lousy, but following that with a 1.1 is just horrible. There just isn’t anything that for me can make up for that combination. Maybe it can for FOX, but not for me. If they renew it, people should lose their heads. Unless it was Murdoch who wanted it renewed, which in that case … it’s his money.
Remember Nick C., the X Files in 1993 was renewed despite very bad ratings. I’d say renew Dollhouse and put it on another night.
“What was unfair about it? They’ve been plenty fair to Joss Whedon over the years, shelling out big time bucks for just the pilot of Firefly–which tanked from the beginning. People seem to forget that the numbers were NEVER good for Firefly, even at the pilot. Then they forked out $50M for a movie which didn’t do well.”
What? Are you suggesting that a film which didn’t even make its budget back (never mind its marketing expenses or the approximately 45% of the gross that goes to the theaters) at the domestic box office didn’t do well? A film which didn’t even make its budget back (never mind its marketing expenses or the approximately 45% of the gross that goes to the theaters) if you combine domestic AND international box office? Are you seriously suggesting that? How can you seriously suggest such a thing? Don’t you know it made eleventy gazillion dollars on DVD and Amazon Unbox and promptly paid for both itself AND a dozen sequels! It was a cash windfall for Universal! Not since “My Big Fat Greek Wedding,” “The Blair Witch Project” and “Slumdog Millionaire” has there been a film as profitable as “Serenity”!!
I hope the Whedonuts and the Brownturds tar and feather you for your slanderous lies! Serenity Now! Serenity Now! Serenity Now!
Dollhouse is a great show! I don’t understand why so many people are dissing it. As with all Joss Whedon shows, they start out slow, but gain more momentum as they go. Look at how Buffy started. If people don’t give it a chance they will never get to show just how amazing they can get. Look at Firefly. We don’t want that to happen again!
There’s a whole host of reasons why Dollhouse didn’t work, and I won’t repeat the ones mentioned here. But how about the fact that they give away just about every twist they are going to do by dropping little hints here and there? This is the worst possible plan. I guess it’s supposed to be clever and pay off the loyal viewers, but instead it leaves the regulars twiddling their thumbs waiting for the inevitable and the casual viewer confused by what seems like a cheap and baseless plot switch.
Next up, either in the finale or in the next (non-existent) season, we’ll all be shocked–shocked!–to find out that Amy Acker’s character is a doll named Whiskey. Casual viewers react with a “Huh, whuh, why? That’s stupid.” The rest of the dwindling audience just yawns.
I like serialized shows. I like Whedon. But Dollhouse, structurally, doesn’t lend itself to large, interesting, sweeping arcs in the storytelling. Or even consistent characters we can still like in the one-offs. It was doomed to fail.
The prostitution angle makes it “realistic”? I missed the memo that new tech is used to make hookers whenever possible. See that was what caused the Bionic Woman to fail, she wasn’t a hooker. I guess JW realized that was Dr. Horrible’s mistake too. The freeze ray should be used to make ice hookers.
It is all so clear now. The little girl in the last ep was just a carrot for season 2, the preteen Dollhouse. “Half the age, twice the price” right. Oh, so that line was foreshadowing, damn those writers are smart, not crass. Let’s really “challenge” the audience and make some Art.
Of course the writers knew what they were doing, they wrote it. And prostitution and rape don’t need support, they’re doing fine I suspect. And thank you Dollhouse because I would have never known they were a problem if it weren’t for Echo. I think I learned about a problem with the environment this week too. I learned I didn’t want to die the week before. Maybe Dollhouse is trying to make us smarter than 5th graders. That was Fox’s master plan all along.
All kidding aside(bad jokes are why I love this website), suggesting an alternate direction for a show, or questioning what aspects of the direction taken lead to its abysmal ratings(not its relative merit mind you) do not equate to the assertion that the writers are without thought or shouldn’t follow their creative instincts. My assertion was maybe those instincts are bad and the thoughts were misguided when your success or failure is measured in millions of viewers. I love T:TSCC and I like Dollhouse, so I am saddened by what happened to them; but it doesn’t surprise me given their tones.
FOX needs to renew TSCC and move it to a better night and pair it with Fringe. A good lead-in would do wonders too. As for Dollhouse; I dunno what they can do there.
Veran, there’s a huge different between you wanting a show to be renewed and the network needing to renew it. You don’t seem to separate the two though.
Does anyone else think it’s quite interesting how everyone is predicting doom for dollhouse and TSCC BUT every friday these are the two shows that the majority of comments are on?
On a random note, I think it’s atrocious that shows like “wife swap” can get the same ratings as complex, fresh and thought-provoking shows like dollhouse and TSCC. What a worry..
Having said that, Fox should give both these shows another season and see if they gather more of an audience. Stop pulling great shows before their time! Sci-fi shows are never going to have the majority of viewers (and no ghost whisper definately does NOT count in that category), so stop trying to make them. Have a few quality sci-fi shows and then a few cheap lame ones to make money. At least that way we will have SOMETHING to watch that requires more than a single neuron to understand it.
Jenn, sadly no. It’s very typical that shows that either have very bad ratings or just sort of average on the bubble ratings generate the most commenting. Nobody is worried about Grey’s Anatomy and Desperate Housewives being renewed so there’s not nearly as much focus on those shows ratings. Similar things happened with shows like Jericho (canceled), Moonlight (canceled), Pushing Daisies (canceled), Kyle XY (canceled)…
yes and people still whine about those shows being canned. maybe they should just stop with the sci-fi shows altogether if they aren’t going to let them go past a season or 2. i’m tired of getting hooked and my shows suddenly yanked away.
I don’t see TSCC or Dollhouse being renewed. Dollhouse is so unwatchable now that I had to force myself to watch part of my recording of it. I loved parts of TSCC and considered myself a hardcore fan of it – but after the awful season finale, I don’t want another season of it. My favorite character was Cameron and they killed off that character. Allison is not Cameron and I couldn’t care less about Allison as a character.
In order for Dollhouse to have been successful in my opinion the concept and a lot of the storylines and casting would have totally had to be redone.
Bottom line is that these shows didn’t have enough live viewers in the right age groups to justify continuing airing.
Also, to me you can’t compare The X-Files or Buffy to Dollhouse. The X-Files made an effort to cut costs by being shot in Vancouver plus Gillian Anderson was a total unknown that they didn’t have to pay much for. None of the actors on Buffy were well known or expensive. Even Dark Angel was filmed in Vancouver. SciFi shows typically aren’t filmed in the U.S. and make every effort to cut costs. Buffy was on a small network where low ratings were acceptable.
Fox moving TSCC and Dollhouse to Fridays pretty much told me at the time that they were only going to last this season and then be cancelled. I don’t know of any network that moves a show that they consider successful on another night to Fridays. Fridays is where you put shows that will just air out their episodes in the can. I was just happy that they aired all of the episodes for TSCC unlike Firefly where they had 3 unaired episodes that could only be seen on the DVD.
RuzaRoos, are you trying to miss my point? Think, man, *think*. It’s the NATURE of the technology that means it would be used the way it is on the show. You couldn’t make freeze ray hookers because there’s no way a freeze ray could be used for prostitution. When you have to the ability to mold people into whatever you want, it follows that it would be used for things like this.
I agree with Christian. People who bitch about the “prostitution” angle on Dollhouse forget that the show is about wiping people’s brains and then assigning them to be murderers, terrorists, assassins, as well as once in a while (like this week) something useful. (Actually I agree with whoever asked the obvious question of this week’s episode – who paid for that? Huge plot hole, folks!)
Complaining about prostitution on Dollhouse is the last thing people should be worrying about when the Internet is riddled with porn and Craigslist is being charged with facilitating prostitution with its ads.
By now, if you’ve watched the show for five minutes, you should know that the Dollhouse is a huge international conspiracy to do…Something Bad. It’s not just a bunch of people being rented out as hookers.
I think one of the flaws in the show was that, originally, Whedon’s concept was just that – it wasn’t a big conspiracy. Fox was the one who suggested that it be bigger and better than that. So we have half the episodes being completely at odds with the other half because the writers don’t know which concept they’re writing for.
I agree with you Richard – I think diverging from the original premise has hurt the overall flow.
Having said that – I’m really enjoying Dollhouse (which I shouldn’t be as I’m a Uker). It starts here on May 19th on Scifi (really small channel).
Regarding Serenity – I’ve been searching, it would appear that it’s made a profit after DVD sales, TV rights, rentals etc. Obviously I can’t find anything official, but it had made a profit.
I would agree – Joss’ works tend to pull small audiences in the US (but with a vocal fan-base), which sort of screwed up the Serenity release. Univeral believed the hype and left it to the fans to create a buzz. Mostly we ended up just promoting it to ourselves and we were already sold.
The UK is slightly different though – Buffy and Angel were well loved. Showed on the BBC to millions – percentage wise Joss’s shows are hits on TV turf. I know this is a US site, so you’re interested in US numbers, but it’s always interested me that figures for sci-fi type shows are way higher over here. Must be something to do with the greater acceptance of this genre in the UK. Serenity was number one in the box office over here, it won Film of the Year on the BBC.
I would agree though, that Joss should think of making shows for the smaller cable network – it would still make a profit and work for him and the US model. However, in the UK, Joss should make shows for the BBC – and then 11million people WOULD turn in and I would be a happy bunny
.
I don’t think we’ll see Joss coming back to US TV though if Dollhouse is not renewed, not for some time anyway. He’s off down the film route, Cabin in the Woods opens next year. It wasn’t as though Joss came up with Dollhouse and then pitched it to fox in the same way as Firefly or Buffy before it.
Kill off DULL HOUSE already. 3 million viewers? Terrible ratings. Whedon has totally lost it. Even the premise wasnt all that good. I tried to watch it a few times and it bored me silly.
TSCC isnt coming back its dead, its the reason it was exiled to Friday nights – aka The Dying TV Show Hospice Zone. Its the same reason Dull House was put on after TSCC. FOX knew both shows were doomed.
DOLLHOUSE IS AMAZING, there hasnt been a single boring EP since it started…it way better than most shows on TV and I dont understand why people arent interested…are you all too plain to enjoy such a great show? it sux , its not fair…I hope theres hope left
Dollhouse is a niche show that should have been on cable instead of network TV to begin with. There’s no potential for a huge audience there at all.
Sci-fi isn’t all that popular on TV nowadays (besides like Fringe, which I’m wiling to bet has a lot of Lost’s audience) in that it can’t hope to even begin to match the amazing visuals one gets from a sci-fi movie in theaters. So sci-fi shows like Dollhouse get hardcore, “geek” fans but basically no impact on the mainstream.
And Fox has treated Whedon fairly, I bet Dollhouse would have underperformed in the post-Idol slot even. Whedon just keeps trying to put cable shows on network TV, that’s all there is to it.
I just watched Friday’s episode of Dollhouse-That was a GREAT piece of TV. I was on the edge of my seat. I have a strong feeling Dollhouse will one day down the road be made into a feature film. Its premise is fasinating and also distubing. It would make for a great two hr movie.
chuck
Joss Whedon should come to the UK to make Ripper for the BBC, a channel which embraced Buffy and showed it to an audience of millions, and where Serenity won film of the year. Sci-Fi/fantasy can work on primetime network TV here in the UK (Torchwood, Doctor Who, Buffy, the Star Trek series), I know Fringe, X-Files etc work in the US, but only if it has some procedural element to it.
It’s a shame that TSCC and Dollhouse look set to be doomed, but I think TSCC could have been a great pair with Fringe. Having said that, if Fringe lost it’s Idol lead in would it be half as successful as it has been?
@Lisa:
“actually dollhouse is produced by: 20th century fox (Fox); Mutant Enemy (Joss Whedon); Diva Production (Eliza Dushku); the cost of any episode is between 1,2/2 million dollar. fox pays a third of the episode”
Is this really how it works? (I know jack squat about television production.) Big pocket FOX would pay only a third while small fry ME and Diva pay two-thirds? Either the industry is even more arcane and bizarre than I thought (entirely possible) or that makes no sense (entirely possible even if true).
shame on you shelley! for calling my favorite show that(mess) also Did ya Know that house wasn’t produced by fox, but produced by NBC picked up by fox,